Political Crossfire Forums

StrikeEmd15 · Joined: 10 Jul 2006 Posts: 106 Location: Mind Your Buisness

Rodack wrote: Let me see, My choices are, being stripped naked and led around on a leash by a woman in combat fatigues or getting my head sliced off by 5 Terrorists, tough choice

You're kidding, right? Personally, I have trouble finding this fair, though I'm incapable of finding a means to define it. Both the things you listed are dispicable. Anyone who does either willingly needs to be locked away from society.

PricklySponge · Joined: 11 May 2005 Posts: 8523

We must hold ourselves on higher moral ground than the terrorists. Torturing simply because they do is unacceptable in our morally superior society.

slitedeviance · Joined: 02 Sep 2006 Posts: 1507

But it's worse than that, because as soon as you start condoning torturing captured enemy troops, you give full credit to the "other side" being able to torture your own. I mean if you can use violent or torturous methods on someone, obviously there is no moral issue here for you. so why do you not care about your own troops being tortured? I mean they're meant to be your Bro's and Sisters...?

Rankor and Pissing · Joined: 04 Mar 2006 Posts: 8898

PricklySponge wrote: We must hold ourselves on higher moral ground than the terrorists. Torturing simply because they do is unacceptable in our morally superior society.

And what advantage tactically does that provide when there is no alternative to the brutality that is set against you? I'm fine with morals - but they're expensive to have when no morals are returned in kind. This isn't like prior wars where "rules of engagement" are utilized and there were some places neither enemy would go because it was considered "uncivilized" or "distasteful". These bastards have pulled the gloves off and we're claiming "morals".

slitedeviance · Joined: 02 Sep 2006 Posts: 1507

Rankor and Pissing wrote: This isn't like prior wars where "rules of engagement" are utilized and there were some places neither enemy would go because it was considered "uncivilized" or "distasteful". These bastards have pulled the gloves off and we're claiming "morals".

Isn't that part of what makes you not similairthem? One of the freedoms and liberties that we're supposedly being hated for?

I don't get it. Fight the war because you want freedom and democracy and human rights, but abide by those yourself, or fight the war because you can. Can someone clear this up? What was the point of the war? Why are we fighting?

Refrozen Seabass · Joined: 19 Apr 2005 Posts: 2682

Rodack wrote: Let me see, My choices are, being stripped naked and led around on a leash by a woman in combat fatigues or getting my head sliced off by 5 Terrorists, tough choice

Those aren't your choices. Your choices are:

A) oppose human rights violations committed by the United States, or

B) support human rights violations committed by the United States.

Rankor and Pissing · Joined: 04 Mar 2006 Posts: 8898

slitedeviance wrote: Rankor and Pissing wrote: This isn't like prior wars where "rules of engagement" are utilized and there were some places neither enemy would go because it was considered "uncivilized" or "distasteful". These bastards have pulled the gloves off and we're claiming "morals".

Isn't that part of what makes you not similairthem? One of the freedoms and liberties that we're supposedly being hated for?

I don't get it. Fight the war because you want freedom and democracy and human rights, but abide by those yourself, or fight the war because you can. Can someone clear this up? What was the point of the war? Why are we fighting?

It maybe that the war of this type has to be fought and won on the enemy's terms using the enemy's tactics. If that invalidates the freedoms gained so far, then so be it. What war are we fighting? One of survival against those who want to kill Democrats, Republicans, Socialists, Communists, Athiests, Christians, Jews, in short - anything that is not like themselves. You must convert - you must reject your way of life and bow to salafists and if you do not, they'll kill you, your family, your children in front of you. Why are we fighting? To preserve our way of life. They are NOT preserving their way of life - they are fighting to convert US to their way ... it's their way or no way. Most westerners have a live and let live attitude - even the overtly Christian ones... but our enemy does not. If you live differently than them, you are an infidel - worthy only to be bought, sold or killed. Period.

Get it now?

Angelicus · Joined: 04 Apr 2006 Posts: 4288

I've noticed that the same people who cry the most about these supposed violations of human rights by the U.S.

Hardly ever having anything to say, much less make anything near the same kinds of condmenmation's, when it comes too these terrorists, and their human rights violations, such as cutting off someone's head with a knife.

I wonder why it is, that they don't hold the terrorists to the same standards.

Is it that they just don't see the threat these terrorists pose to litterally our way of life?

Or

Is it more nefarious than that.

Is it that these people are just traitors to our cause? That these people are actually on the side of the terrorists?

I used too think the former was the case, but as more and more time goes by, I'm starting too think, that maybe, it may indeed be the latter.

emerald · Joined: 05 Apr 2005 Posts: 7331 Location: uk

i think u'd have noticed that those that are going on about US human rights violations and condemn torture on people also feel the same way towards anyone who uses torture including the terrorists. but the big difference between the terrorists and the west is that the terrorists dont seem to a give a crap about human rights or decency, and dont preach about it, whereas the west do. so it becomes hypocritical when the side that preaches about it starts doing it, and finds excuses for it.

Rankor and Pissing · Joined: 04 Mar 2006 Posts: 8898

Angelicus wrote: I've noticed that the same people who cry the most about these supposed violations of human rights by the U.S.

Hardly ever having anything to say, much less make anything near the same kinds of condmenmation's, when it comes too these terrorists, and their human rights violations, such as cutting off someone's head with a knife.

I wonder why it is, that they don't hold the terrorists to the same standards.

Is it that they just don't see the threat these terrorists pose to litterally our way of life?

Or

Is it more nefarious than that.

Is it that these people are just traitors to our cause? That these people are actually on the side of the terrorists?

I used too think the former was the case, but as more and more time goes by, I'm starting too think, that maybe, it may indeed be the latter.

To give those American's you cite the benefit of the doubt... I think it's because it's expected of terrorists to do all these thing. American's are supposed to be these mythical creatures who's morality and sense of person is so high, that they simply cannot fathom or think to use such methods themselves. The truth of the matter is, we're just like everyone else - no more moral, no more mythical and just as flawed.

Shepherd · Joined: 18 Aug 2006 Posts: 20

I recently read a book called Stasiland by Anna Funder and she interviewed a lady who was imprisoned in East Germany when the GDR was in power. The Stasi, the secret police, forced her (the interviewee’s name is Miriam) to stay awake for days. She explains sleep deprivation has serious psychological affects. I want to get the book to quote exactly what those were but my impression after reading that is sleep deprevation is on the list of torture and should not be allowed. Other things though like small rations and in general making life uncomfortable is something all prisons should adhere to.