Political Crossfire Forums

[Brooklyn]

error....sorry.

[feederband]

JLB wrote: Alizard wrote: Divinity11 wrote:
Gee, I haven't noticed gas prices dropping in my area since, well, a month before the elections. 6 weeks, huh?

Oil is now 55 dollars a barrel. Should we see at least a "little" relief at the pump, as in the price going down a few cents? Or is Big Oil gonna continue to gouge us and have the audacity to post record profits once again, as well as get windfall tax breaks?

When oil prices go up, Big Oil raises gas prices.

When oil goes down, they raise gas prices and claim it's not the price of crude that determines gas prices, it's refinery capacity.

If usage drops, they raise prices and say they have fixed refinery cost they have to recoup on less sales.

If usage goes up, they raise gas prices and claim it's the law of supply and demand.

When nothing changes at all , they raise gas prices and claim it's because they have to sell different formula gas in different states.

You get the idea.....

So are gas priices higher now, or lower than a few months ago, hmmm? 8:)

In my area gas is down about 34% and I think the price of oil is down 32% if my calculations are correct...

So Looks about right...

[JLB]

feederband wrote: JLB wrote: Alizard wrote: Divinity11 wrote:
Gee, I haven't noticed gas prices dropping in my area since, well, a month before the elections. 6 weeks, huh?

Oil is now 55 dollars a barrel. Should we see at least a "little" relief at the pump, as in the price going down a few cents? Or is Big Oil gonna continue to gouge us and have the audacity to post record profits once again, as well as get windfall tax breaks?

When oil prices go up, Big Oil raises gas prices.

When oil goes down, they raise gas prices and claim it's not the price of crude that determines gas prices, it's refinery capacity.

If usage drops, they raise prices and say they have fixed refinery cost they have to recoup on less sales.

If usage goes up, they raise gas prices and claim it's the law of supply and demand.

When nothing changes at all , they raise gas prices and claim it's because they have to sell different formula gas in different states.

You get the idea.....

So are gas priices higher now, or lower than a few months ago, hmmm? 8:)

In my area gas is down about 34% and I think the price of oil is down 32% if my calculations are correct...

So Looks about right...

My god!

They gave away 2% of profits!

It must be Hugo Chavez's doing. :lol:

[GTTofAK]

feederband wrote: In my area gas is down about 34% and I think the price of oil is down 32% if my calculations are correct...

So Looks about right...

Its a conspiracy :gmo:

[sLiPpY]

homerjay_s wrote: Since the Democrats are already taking heat on all sorts of things before they've even taken control of the legislature, is it not only fair to credit them with the falling oil prices?

I'd love to say that, but it's kind of like George Bush or Bill Clinton taking credit for things they have nothing to do with.

Politicians do so all of the time.

I think it's interesting that an economic "slow-down" is forecast for the US.

I'd be interested to know what is at the basis of that forecast.

[feederband]

sLiPpY wrote: homerjay_s wrote: Since the Democrats are already taking heat on all sorts of things before they've even taken control of the legislature, is it not only fair to credit them with the falling oil prices?

I'd love to say that, but it's kind of like George Bush or Bill Clinton taking credit for things they have nothing to do with.

Politicians do so all of the time.

I think it's interesting that an economic "slow-down" is forecast for the US.

I'd be interested to know what is at the basis of that forecast.

Cloudy skies and low humidity... :lol:

[JLB]

sLiPpY wrote: homerjay_s wrote: Since the Democrats are already taking heat on all sorts of things before they've even taken control of the legislature, is it not only fair to credit them with the falling oil prices?

I'd love to say that, but it's kind of like George Bush or Bill Clinton taking credit for things they have nothing to do with.

Politicians do so all of the time.

I think it's interesting that an economic "slow-down" is forecast for the US.

I'd be interested to know what is at the basis of that forecast.

A Democrat controlled Congress is a sure sign of impending economic doom. 8:)


More oil/gas graphs.

[JLB]

Supply and demand even works in Canada, Alizard. 8:)

[Divinity11]

JLB wrote: Alizard wrote: Divinity11 wrote:
Gee, I haven't noticed gas prices dropping in my area since, well, a month before the elections. 6 weeks, huh?

Oil is now 55 dollars a barrel. Should we see at least a "little" relief at the pump, as in the price going down a few cents? Or is Big Oil gonna continue to gouge us and have the audacity to post record profits once again, as well as get windfall tax breaks?

When oil prices go up, Big Oil raises gas prices.

When oil goes down, they raise gas prices and claim it's not the price of crude that determines gas prices, it's refinery capacity.

If usage drops, they raise prices and say they have fixed refinery cost they have to recoup on less sales.

If usage goes up, they raise gas prices and claim it's the law of supply and demand.

When nothing changes at all , they raise gas prices and claim it's because they have to sell different formula gas in different states.

You get the idea.....

Educate yourself. 8:)



If your chart is accurate, then should we expect unleaded gas to go down several cents over the next week or two?

[GTTofAK]

sLiPpY wrote: homerjay_s wrote: Since the Democrats are already taking heat on all sorts of things before they've even taken control of the legislature, is it not only fair to credit them with the falling oil prices?

I'd love to say that, but it's kind of like George Bush or Bill Clinton taking credit for things they have nothing to do with.

Politicians do so all of the time.

I think it's interesting that an economic "slow-down" is forecast for the US.

I'd be interested to know what is at the basis of that forecast.

Yeah that would be like opening up the strategic oil reserve just days before before gas historically takes a down turn in price and then taking credit for the drop.

Oh wait yeah that did happen. One guess who did it. Never mind the risk that puts the nation at since the SOR exists only to supply our military with fuel long enough for them to secure sources and demotic production to ramp up. Hence the word strategic.

[Trajan]

GTTofAK wrote: It takes time for gas prices to drop due to the throttling effect. It is this effect that makes people think the market is rigged but its not.



The only time it takes is an email and someone changing the price on the sign.

[GTTofAK]

Trajan wrote: GTTofAK wrote: It takes time for gas prices to drop due to the throttling effect. It is this effect that makes people think the market is rigged but its not.



The only time it takes is an email and someone changing the price on the sign.

That's about as ignorant a comment you can have. You tell that local gas station owner to sell his gas for less than he paid for it.

[Alizard]

JLB wrote: Alizard wrote: Divinity11 wrote:
Gee, I haven't noticed gas prices dropping in my area since, well, a month before the elections. 6 weeks, huh?

Oil is now 55 dollars a barrel. Should we see at least a "little" relief at the pump, as in the price going down a few cents? Or is Big Oil gonna continue to gouge us and have the audacity to post record profits once again, as well as get windfall tax breaks?

When oil prices go up, Big Oil raises gas prices.

When oil goes down, they raise gas prices and claim it's not the price of crude that determines gas prices, it's refinery capacity.

If usage drops, they raise prices and say they have fixed refinery cost they have to recoup on less sales.

If usage goes up, they raise gas prices and claim it's the law of supply and demand.

When nothing changes at all , they raise gas prices and claim it's because they have to sell different formula gas in different states.

You get the idea.....

Educate yourself.

I'va already got more work than I can handle trying to educate you.

[JLB]

Divinity11 wrote: JLB wrote: Alizard wrote: Divinity11 wrote:
Gee, I haven't noticed gas prices dropping in my area since, well, a month before the elections. 6 weeks, huh?

Oil is now 55 dollars a barrel. Should we see at least a "little" relief at the pump, as in the price going down a few cents? Or is Big Oil gonna continue to gouge us and have the audacity to post record profits once again, as well as get windfall tax breaks?

When oil prices go up, Big Oil raises gas prices.

When oil goes down, they raise gas prices and claim it's not the price of crude that determines gas prices, it's refinery capacity.

If usage drops, they raise prices and say they have fixed refinery cost they have to recoup on less sales.

If usage goes up, they raise gas prices and claim it's the law of supply and demand.

When nothing changes at all , they raise gas prices and claim it's because they have to sell different formula gas in different states.

You get the idea.....

Educate yourself. 8:)



If your chart is accurate, then should we expect unleaded gas to go down several cents over the next week or two?

That depends on if your state requires a certain formula of gasoline, and how much they tax you.

All other things being equal, then yes, it should drop.

My prices are down around $2.25 where I am.

[JLB]

Alizard wrote: JLB wrote: Alizard wrote: Divinity11 wrote:
Gee, I haven't noticed gas prices dropping in my area since, well, a month before the elections. 6 weeks, huh?

Oil is now 55 dollars a barrel. Should we see at least a "little" relief at the pump, as in the price going down a few cents? Or is Big Oil gonna continue to gouge us and have the audacity to post record profits once again, as well as get windfall tax breaks?

When oil prices go up, Big Oil raises gas prices.

When oil goes down, they raise gas prices and claim it's not the price of crude that determines gas prices, it's refinery capacity.

If usage drops, they raise prices and say they have fixed refinery cost they have to recoup on less sales.

If usage goes up, they raise gas prices and claim it's the law of supply and demand.

When nothing changes at all , they raise gas prices and claim it's because they have to sell different formula gas in different states.

You get the idea.....

Educate yourself.

I'va already got more work than I can handle trying to educate you.

You can't improve on perfection. 8:)

So, have prices dropped this year, or not?

[Alizard]

GTTofAK wrote:
To put it as simply as possible. When the price of raw materials is rising the retail price rises just as fast because of the need to replace inventory. When the price of raw materials is dropping the retail price drops far slower because of the need to make a profit.

Look. I don't mean to sound as condescending as your posts, but I am in business and probably have taken more courses in business economics than most people.

You are, quite simply, blowing smoke.

"Profit" is not an instantaneous event, it is an ongoing process of sales and expenditures.

Your claim that if material costs go up it INSTANTLY requires raising prices is specious. It doesn't, and if they do their profits will jump while they "pump out" WIP (which if you are a business expert, know means Work In process), since all that product was produced using lower-cost raw material.

This is particularly wrong:


Quote: When the price of raw materials is dropping the retail price drops far slower because of the need to make a profit.

No, No, NO! "Profit" is not declared at the end of the day, it's the end of the quarter.... or year, or whatever. There is no fixed time limit. And if prices are dropping for material, most businesses are forced to drop product prices NOW to hold market share. WHY? Well: if production and material costs are down (and we don't lower prices) somebdoy else will set up shop and produce the product for the CURRENT GOING rate to make $XX profit (which will be a lower price than ours) and steal all our market share. And when you are not selling your product, your profit is ZERO!

The notion that businesses are forced to "hold a price" to make a specific profit margin on WIP while it pumps out is just WRONG.

I am trying to be more polite, so I will simply close by saying you are wrong. There is no inherent assymetry in business forcing rising costs to be reflected at the retail level faster than lowered costs must be.

BTW: what you are saying also defies common sense, and that is always a signal to re-think your data.

[Alizard]

JLB wrote:

You can't improve on perfection. 8:)

So, have prices dropped this year, or not?

Do you mean gasoline? Yes, there was some reduction from the astronomical levels that Big Oil pumped them up to, but they are still too high. And the reduction was for the election, and it remains to be seen how fast they will ramp them back up.

They don't hold elections every year, you know.

Or will you be making some more predictions for the prices?

We always look forward to your predictions.

[Alizard]

JLB wrote: Supply and demand even works in Canada, Alizard. 8:)


Amazing the BS some people will swallow.

Considering the fact that there were no shortages of gas here in the US, how is it you will simply accept the excuse "tight gasoline supply" and grab your ankles for Big Oil while they send prices to the moon?

Tight? Really? Where was it tight..... whose refinery had to work extra shifts to meet demand...? Where is the extra cost from buying more trucks or tankers?

What a load of pure horse manure.

And you buy it because to admit the truth would be to admit Big Oil owns the administration.

And I am still stunned when I find people who don't admit that is true....

[JLB]

[quote="Alizard"] GTTofAK wrote:
To put it as simply as possible. When the price of raw materials is rising the retail price rises just as fast because of the need to replace inventory. When the price of raw materials is dropping the retail price drops far slower because of the need to make a profit.

Quote: Look. I don't mean to sound as condescending as your posts, but I am in business and probably have taken more courses in business economics than most people.

You should ask for a refund. 8:)


Quote: You are, quite simply, blowing smoke.

So prices didn't go down then?

Because you said they always go up here.....

Alizard wrote:

When oil prices go up, Big Oil raises gas prices.

When oil goes down, they raise gas prices and claim it's not the price of crude that determines gas prices, it's refinery capacity.

If usage drops, they raise prices and say they have fixed refinery cost they have to recoup on less sales.

If usage goes up, they raise gas prices and claim it's the law of supply and demand.

When nothing changes at all , they raise gas prices and claim it's because they have to sell different formula gas in different states.

You get the idea.....

I get the idea you haven't got a clue. :lol:



Quote:
"Profit" is not an instantaneous event, it is an ongoing process of sales and expenditures.

Gee, really? Accounting 101....


Quote: Your claim that if material costs go up it INSTANTLY requires raising prices is specious.

Did I say that?

Where?

Quote: It doesn't, and if they do their profits will jump while they "pump out" WIP (which if you are a business expert, know means Work In process), since all that product was produced using lower-cost raw material.

This is particularly wrong:


Quote: When the price of raw materials is dropping the retail price drops far slower because of the need to make a profit.

No, No, NO! "Profit" is not declared at the end of the day, it's the end of the quarter.... or year, or whatever. There is no fixed time limit. And if prices are dropping for material, most businesses are forced to drop product prices NOW to hold market share. WHY? Well: if production and material costs are down (and we don't lower prices) somebdoy else will set up shop and produce the product for the CURRENT GOING rate to make $XX profit (which will be a lower price than ours) and steal all our market share. And when you are not selling your product, your profit is ZERO!

The notion that businesses are forced to "hold a price" to make a specific profit margin on WIP while it pumps out is just WRONG.

I am trying to be more polite, so I will simply close by saying you are wrong. There is no inherent assymetry in business forcing rising costs to be reflected at the retail level faster than lowered costs must be.

BTW: what you are saying also defies common sense, and that is always a signal to re-think your data.


Let the record show that I said absolutely none of the above on this thread, and Alizard is talking to himself, as far as I can tell...... :lol:



So, Alizard....

Did gas prices fall this year?

[JLB]

[quote="Alizard"] JLB wrote: Supply and demand even works in Canada, Alizard. 8:)


Quote: Amazing the BS some people will swallow.

Hence, the existance of the Democrat Party.

Quote: Considering the fact that there were no shortages of gas here in the US, how is it you will simply accept the excuse "tight gasoline supply" and grab your ankles for Big Oil while they send prices to the moon?

Gee, maybe because I watch the crude oil prices track nearly identically to the gasoline prices for the past few decades..... 8:)


Quote: Tight? Really? Where was it tight..... whose refinery had to work extra shifts to meet demand...? Where is the extra cost from buying more trucks or tankers?

What a load of pure horse manure.

And you buy it because to admit the truth would be to admit Big Oil owns the administration.

And I am still stunned when I find people who don't admit that is true....


Big oil owns the administration, so it made gas prices go way up in an election year, for no apparent reason.

Great theory. :lol: