Political Crossfire Forums

jmac87 · Joined: 11 Nov 2006 Posts: 3 Location: Florida

Before all you liberals get your panties in a bundle let me explain. After September 11th when congress voted to go to war in Iraq it was not only the republicans that voted yes to war. As a matter of fact a lot of democrats sided with bush on this war. When Clinton bombed Iraq it was never questioned again but now that the war isn't over and the republicans were in control of the government the democrats started pointing fingers and badmouthing the "Republican" solution to September 11th. By doing this they have divided the country and now have nearly 2/3Rd's of our people not happy with the job our government is doing. They're probably real happy now because they just took over the government in what was possibly the most pathetic attempt to gain votes I've ever seen. They've been badmouthing republicans for the past two years solid and it worked. Partly because people are so eager to get this whole situation over with that they readily accept all the accusations and false promises. I assure you the Democratic cloud is without a silver lining. You(democrats) are all a bunch of snakes in the grass as far as I'm concerned. In either case now your stuck with a divided country and a divided government that nobody has any confidence in so the second the people realize that the democrats aren't going to solve their problems the gloves will come off. Good luck cause were all going to need it.

micfranklin · Posted: Sat Nov 11, 2006 3:48 pm Post subject:

Umm...yeah........ :?

zentrait · Joined: 10 Mar 2005 Posts: 532

Aren't we pointing fingers now?

...we all were duped by the current administration after 9/11. Someone said WMD's in Iraq, everyone jumped on the band wagon... republicans haven't ruined this country, democrats haven't ruined this country... our own naivety has contributed to it.

Fido · Joined: 16 Mar 2006 Posts: 3936

Giving a cop the power to use force to bring a criminal to justice is not a license to kill.

If you give a dim wit like Mr. Bush authority to use force I guess you have to expect just about anything. But we do have a process in this country for going to war, and not just using necessary force. If Bush had been a gentleman, and not some rich kid punk, he would have laid everything out before the whole government and the whole people and asked for their unqualified and unstinting support. He got what he wanted, and wanted what he got. He got the authority he asked for, but did not face the ugly reality of all war. You can start them, but only God knows when they will be ended.

Fido · Joined: 16 Mar 2006 Posts: 3936

zentrait wrote: Aren't we pointing fingers now?

...we all were duped by the current administration after 9/11. Someone said WMD's in Iraq, everyone jumped on the band wagon... republicans haven't ruined this country, democrats haven't ruined this country... our own naivety has contributed to it.

Why don't you show me where it says democrats and republicans in the united states constitution. Parties have cut this country down the middle since it was born, and not one of them has the needle and thread to sew it back up. So don't say they have not ruined this country. Only a party dink could tell that lie with a straight face.
And being duped by a dumbell is hardly a recommendation for leadership. I assure you there are smarter people than Mr. Bush our leaders will have to deal with on the world scene. Are we going to let all of them trick us into a dead end alley? If our government were a meritocracy none of these politician could get above sweeping the floors or cleaning the toilets.

Melcar · Posted: Sat Nov 11, 2006 8:27 pm Post subject:

Democrats are just as responsible as Republicans for the shi**y situation we are in. It's all about the damage bipartisan politics do. Both parties are constantly trying to outwit eachother to get the upper hand, and unfortunately the ones that end up suffering for it are the citizens.

zentrait · Joined: 10 Mar 2005 Posts: 532

Fido wrote: zentrait wrote: Aren't we pointing fingers now?

...we all were duped by the current administration after 9/11. Someone said WMD's in Iraq, everyone jumped on the band wagon... republicans haven't ruined this country, democrats haven't ruined this country... our own naivety has contributed to it.

Why don't you show me where it says democrats and republicans in the united states constitution. Parties have cut this country down the middle since it was born, and not one of them has the needle and thread to sew it back up. So don't say they have not ruined this country. Only a party dink could tell that lie with a straight face.
And being duped by a dumbell is hardly a recommendation for leadership. I assure you there are smarter people than Mr. Bush our leaders will have to deal with on the world scene. Are we going to let all of them trick us into a dead end alley? If our government were a meritocracy none of these politician could get above sweeping the floors or cleaning the toilets.

woe...down boy, heal... this nonpartisan dink is with you on this one. But it's americans that have had a hand in splitting this country... be it repubs or dems or indep, we are all niave enough to buy into some difference between them, it's not like repubs and dems are from some other country... maybe some other world, but they are still americans, and as such, have had a hand in the current crisis.

perdidochas · Joined: 06 Mar 2006 Posts: 14795 Location: Florida

Fido wrote: zentrait wrote: Aren't we pointing fingers now?

...we all were duped by the current administration after 9/11. Someone said WMD's in Iraq, everyone jumped on the band wagon... republicans haven't ruined this country, democrats haven't ruined this country... our own naivety has contributed to it.

Why don't you show me where it says democrats and republicans in the united states constitution. Parties have cut this country down the middle since it was born, and not one of them has the needle and thread to sew it back up. So don't say they have not ruined this country. Only a party dink could tell that lie with a straight face.
And being duped by a dumbell is hardly a recommendation for leadership. I assure you there are smarter people than Mr. Bush our leaders will have to deal with on the world scene. Are we going to let all of them trick us into a dead end alley? If our government were a meritocracy none of these politician could get above sweeping the floors or cleaning the toilets.

A couple of things: 1) the party system evolved, so you're right, it is not in the Constitution, but it is also not prohibited by the Constitution (which is the more important point). 2) the Republicans are a third party (the Whig party and the Dems were once the two parties). 3) this country isn't a meritocracy, there is no such thing as a working meritocracy.

Fido · Joined: 16 Mar 2006 Posts: 3936

zentrait wrote: Fido wrote: zentrait wrote: Aren't we pointing fingers now?

...we all were duped by the current administration after 9/11. Someone said WMD's in Iraq, everyone jumped on the band wagon... republicans haven't ruined this country, democrats haven't ruined this country... our own naivety has contributed to it.

Why don't you show me where it says democrats and republicans in the united states constitution. Parties have cut this country down the middle since it was born, and not one of them has the needle and thread to sew it back up. So don't say they have not ruined this country. Only a party dink could tell that lie with a straight face.
And being duped by a dumbell is hardly a recommendation for leadership. I assure you there are smarter people than Mr. Bush our leaders will have to deal with on the world scene. Are we going to let all of them trick us into a dead end alley? If our government were a meritocracy none of these politician could get above sweeping the floors or cleaning the toilets.

woe...down boy, heal... this nonpartisan dink is with you on this one. But it's americans that have had a hand in splitting this country... be it repubs or dems or indep, we are all niave enough to buy into some difference between them, it's not like repubs and dems are from some other country... maybe some other world, but they are still americans, and as such, have had a hand in the current crisis.

We have little choice. I have to hold my nose to vote democratic, and try to not vote when I do not perceive a difference. Who does that empower? No one, but the machine. They all know if it gets down to three votes some one is going to walk away with a mandate. Many people do not vote because they do not perceive that it makes a difference, and it is hard to argue in an election where over two hundred thousand people vote for two candidates that one vote does count. It is a perversion of our republican system perpetrated by both parties that has allowed this situation to evolve. This was a hold over from England, and there is no evidence that parties protect our rights and plenty of evidence that they are the enemies of our rights.

So, I do not blame the people, but even people on this forum dream about the kind of power wielded by representatives without the understanding that this is power over us, and not for us. It is power very often surrendered by a slim majority that all have to endure. And it makes representatives who are elected to represent only their own constituents into part of a vast national conspiracy that plays section against section, and interest against interest always at the expense of local issues. Parties have not made us a land of winners and losers, but a land peopled almost exclusively by losers. I can't blame the people for dealing with a monster that is big enough to swallow them whole. I do recognize in their essential immorality -which translates into a willingness to see others screwed- as the base cause of everyone being screwed.

Fido · Joined: 16 Mar 2006 Posts: 3936

perdidochas wrote: Fido wrote: zentrait wrote: Aren't we pointing fingers now?

...we all were duped by the current administration after 9/11. Someone said WMD's in Iraq, everyone jumped on the band wagon... republicans haven't ruined this country, democrats haven't ruined this country... our own naivety has contributed to it.

Why don't you show me where it says democrats and republicans in the united states constitution. Parties have cut this country down the middle since it was born, and not one of them has the needle and thread to sew it back up. So don't say they have not ruined this country. Only a party dink could tell that lie with a straight face.
And being duped by a dumbell is hardly a recommendation for leadership. I assure you there are smarter people than Mr. Bush our leaders will have to deal with on the world scene. Are we going to let all of them trick us into a dead end alley? If our government were a meritocracy none of these politician could get above sweeping the floors or cleaning the toilets.

A couple of things: 1) the party system evolved, so you're right, it is not in the Constitution, but it is also not prohibited by the Constitution (which is the more important point). 2) the Republicans are a third party (the Whig party and the Dems were once the two parties). 3) this country isn't a meritocracy, there is no such thing as a working meritocracy.

The party system was taken up whole from British politics where I trust it served them better. A lot of things are not prohibited by the constitution, and much that is prohibited by the constitution goes on without let up. And I would offer the Catholic Church as a meritocracy. People who could not make it work at a low level were not raised to a higher level; but then that is one reason they loved Plato.

For our part, our leaders can be leaders on the basis of nothing and the more nothing the better. How many times have you seen words and votes taken out of context? We let moral quibbles in a person's past disqualify them for office without considering the moral questions involved in putting an idiot in charge of our nuclear armory. And what about making unqualified clowns into our commander in chief on the basis of party? None of this would be possible without the huge and unwarranted power given to party. Do you believe Emanuel or Melleman stood for any national office? Who elected them to plan strategy or sling mud? This power of party is outside of government, and detrimental to our society and degrading to our honor, integrity, and liberty. It is not a question of freedom of speech or association. These are our servants, and should behave appropriately. These are our dogs, and if we can't make them not shet in the living room then they have to go. We can do without them in a heart beat. But wow! Gee, then our representatives might have to vote as we see fit. What a surprise that might be.

Party is the form of organization that gives the elected power over the electors. That organization must be ended.

usa-1 · Joined: 09 Apr 2006 Posts: 80

:lol:
jmac87: Before all you liberals get your panties in a bundle let me explain.

1.After September 11th when congress voted to go to war in Iraq it was not only the republicans that voted yes to war. As a matter of fact a lot of democrats sided with bush on this war.

A.After they were lied to by the Bush Administartion,...yes, then they voted for war.

2.When Clinton bombed Iraq it was never questioned again but now that the war isn't over and the republicans were in control of the government the democrats started pointing fingers and badmouthing the "Republican" solution to September 11th.

A.Your mixing true apples with false oranges. Being a sheared sheeple of the Bush regime, I doubt that makes any sense to you, but you might as well said when the moon turned blue, yadda-yadda.

3.By doing this they have divided the country and now have nearly 2/3Rd's of our people not happy with the job our government is doing.

A.The country was divided the day the Republicans falsely accused the Democrats of being responsible for 911, and set an agenda to prove that Bush was clean as sheared sheep wool. It was divided when Trent Lott stood in the Senate and declared war against the Democrats. It was divided when Bush demanded of his clearly illegal lying-assed war, you are either with us or against us.

4.They're probably real happy now because they just took over the government in what was possibly the most pathetic attempt to gain votes I've ever seen.

A. I can see how you would believe a fair election without Republcans stealing it, blocking voting booths, pulling a Tom Delay, is a pathetic election of your Republicans that you have ever seen. Surprised me as well. By the way, I am estatic!!!

5.They've been badmouthing republicans for the past two years solid and it worked. Partly because people are so eager to get this whole situation over with that they readily accept all the accusations and false promises.

A. I think we have been bad mouthing Republicans for years, at least as far back in my recollections. Yes, by Allah dabba-doo, it has been years, and I bet some people were just like you said, while others were not.

6.I assure you the Democratic cloud is without a silver lining.

A.There is no evidence of that, but your welcome to present your case over the coming years of Dem Congressional control. I notice that is some kind of voodoo hoodoo warning. Are you a magi or carry a crystal ball? Palm reader? Snake dancer? Or just another Christian picking up sound waves from UFOs and big foots in the night?

7.You(democrats) are all a bunch of snakes in the grass as far as I'm concerned.

A.Ah, you were doing so good for a Republican sheared sheeple, wanting a united nation of fun loving people, and then you start name calling, and making false insinuations of good ol Democrat Christian people who live all around you, take care of your wife when you are at work (tv repairmen, milkmen, delivery men), and provide the tax base you hungry republicans need to continue killing American soldiers in Iraq. Did you know a lot of people that voted for the Democrat ticket were republicans?

8.In either case now your stuck with a divided country and a divided government that nobody has any confidence in

A.Let me ask you, would you have confidence in a government run by an idiot, a habitual liar, a person who aborted his own son in a Texas abortion clinic, that was a drunk for half of his life, who is a draft dodger, who thinks a "C" grade is good enough for the nation, who drinks and drives the streets of America where children are present, who attempted to stop the 911 investigation, that puts the rich & their tax cuts before the nations military and their family needs, ...............well, I could go on,..but being a divided nation lacking confidence, selfrespect, shamed by the worlds nations seems to be a result of the Republican control of government. It will take years to re-establish America in the minds and hearts of the World, It will take years before they trust us, or help us when a legitimate war comes along. Our credibility has been cashed in by the Bush regime and sheared sheeple like yourself, so get over it.

9. so the second the people realize that the democrats aren't going to solve their problems the gloves will come off. Good luck cause were all going to need it.

A.Well their was the bj problem they had to solve, but most of the future problems will be undoing the monster the Republicans have created, and the voting public know that it will take about 30 years or so of Democrat rule to straighten this train wreck of the Axis of Bush evil out. The American people understand what faces them, that is why they voted their conscience in the Congress, and I bet they follow that up with a Democrat President when the dew forms on the pumpkin - maybe an impeachment before then - for the sake of the troops I hope so.
:-D Be happy

Somebloke · Joined: 08 May 2006 Posts: 2380 Location: London

jmac87 wrote: Before all you liberals get your panties in a bundle let me explain. After September 11th when congress voted to go to war in Iraq it was not only the republicans that voted yes to war. As a matter of fact a lot of democrats sided with bush on this war. When Clinton bombed Iraq it was never questioned again but now that the war isn't over and the republicans were in control of the government the democrats started pointing fingers and badmouthing the "Republican" solution to September 11th. By doing this they have divided the country and now have nearly 2/3Rd's of our people not happy with the job our government is doing. They're probably real happy now because they just took over the government in what was possibly the most pathetic attempt to gain votes I've ever seen. They've been badmouthing republicans for the past two years solid and it worked. Partly because people are so eager to get this whole situation over with that they readily accept all the accusations and false promises. I assure you the Democratic cloud is without a silver lining. You(democrats) are all a bunch of snakes in the grass as far as I'm concerned. In either case now your stuck with a divided country and a divided government that nobody has any confidence in so the second the people realize that the democrats aren't going to solve their problems the gloves will come off. Good luck cause were all going to need it.

I did not actually believe that you could smell bile over electronic communications, but now I stand corrected.

Of course, it doesn't quite compare with some of the things that were said by democrat hopefuls when Bush was re-elected.

JoeBen81 · Joined: 13 Jun 2006 Posts: 4162

jmac87 wrote: Before all you liberals get your panties in a bundle let me explain. After September 11th when congress voted to go to war in Iraq it was not only the republicans that voted yes to war. As a matter of fact a lot of democrats sided with bush on this war. When Clinton bombed Iraq it was never questioned again but now that the war isn't over and the republicans were in control of the government the democrats started pointing fingers and badmouthing the "Republican" solution to September 11th. By doing this they have divided the country and now have nearly 2/3Rd's of our people not happy with the job our government is doing. They're probably real happy now because they just took over the government in what was possibly the most pathetic attempt to gain votes I've ever seen. They've been badmouthing republicans for the past two years solid and it worked. Partly because people are so eager to get this whole situation over with that they readily accept all the accusations and false promises. I assure you the Democratic cloud is without a silver lining. You(democrats) are all a bunch of snakes in the grass as far as I'm concerned. In either case now your stuck with a divided country and a divided government that nobody has any confidence in so the second the people realize that the democrats aren't going to solve their problems the gloves will come off. Good luck cause were all going to need it.
For some reason, when the first line says "don't get you panties in a bundle," I usually dont expect to get insulted again and called a snake.
Thanks for reminding us why we voted the way we did.

Somebloke · Joined: 08 May 2006 Posts: 2380 Location: London

JoeBen81 wrote: jmac87 wrote: Before all you liberals get your panties in a bundle let me explain. After September 11th when congress voted to go to war in Iraq it was not only the republicans that voted yes to war. As a matter of fact a lot of democrats sided with bush on this war. When Clinton bombed Iraq it was never questioned again but now that the war isn't over and the republicans were in control of the government the democrats started pointing fingers and badmouthing the "Republican" solution to September 11th. By doing this they have divided the country and now have nearly 2/3Rd's of our people not happy with the job our government is doing. They're probably real happy now because they just took over the government in what was possibly the most pathetic attempt to gain votes I've ever seen. They've been badmouthing republicans for the past two years solid and it worked. Partly because people are so eager to get this whole situation over with that they readily accept all the accusations and false promises. I assure you the Democratic cloud is without a silver lining. You(democrats) are all a bunch of snakes in the grass as far as I'm concerned. In either case now your stuck with a divided country and a divided government that nobody has any confidence in so the second the people realize that the democrats aren't going to solve their problems the gloves will come off. Good luck cause were all going to need it.
For some reason, when the first line says "don't get you panties in a bundle," I usually dont expect to get insulted again and called a snake.
Thanks for reminding us why we voted the way we did.

Speak for yourself. I find the way they slither b***dy cool.

californian conservative · Joined: 08 Jul 2006 Posts: 3946 Location: Michigan

jmac87 wrote: Before all you liberals get your panties in a bundle let me explain. After September 11th when congress voted to go to war in Iraq it was not only the republicans that voted yes to war. As a matter of fact a lot of democrats sided with bush on this war. When Clinton bombed Iraq it was never questioned again but now that the war isn't over and the republicans were in control of the government the democrats started pointing fingers and badmouthing the "Republican" solution to September 11th. By doing this they have divided the country and now have nearly 2/3Rd's of our people not happy with the job our government is doing. They're probably real happy now because they just took over the government in what was possibly the most pathetic attempt to gain votes I've ever seen. They've been badmouthing republicans for the past two years solid and it worked. Partly because people are so eager to get this whole situation over with that they readily accept all the accusations and false promises. I assure you the Democratic cloud is without a silver lining. You(democrats) are all a bunch of snakes in the grass as far as I'm concerned. In either case now your stuck with a divided country and a divided government that nobody has any confidence in so the second the people realize that the democrats aren't going to solve their problems the gloves will come off. Good luck cause were all going to need it.

First off when have people ever been happy with our government? People always complain and complaining brings changes which believe it or not are GOOD. This has always been a partisan country and things will never change. People who want a utopia are kidding themselves. However, say that, I must say that partisan politics can be destructive in its means. Note that i said means, not ends. In many cases the two sides have two equally validated points. The other may disagree as much as they like, but there is no need to demonize or belittle the other side's opinions. You my good sir have fallen vicitim to this. You belittle the democrats and their contributions (yes they do have contributions). You are just an example of the partisan politics that you bemoan.

The Grandmaster · Posted: Mon Nov 13, 2006 11:58 am Post subject: Re: democrats ruined our country

jmac87 wrote: Before all you liberals get your panties in a bundle let me explain. After September 11th when congress voted to go to war in Iraq it was not only the republicans that voted yes to war. As a matter of fact a lot of democrats sided with bush on this war. When Clinton bombed Iraq it was never questioned again but now that the war isn't over and the republicans were in control of the government the democrats started pointing fingers and badmouthing the "Republican" solution to September 11th. By doing this they have divided the country and now have nearly 2/3Rd's of our people not happy with the job our government is doing. They're probably real happy now because they just took over the government in what was possibly the most pathetic attempt to gain votes I've ever seen. They've been badmouthing republicans for the past two years solid and it worked. Partly because people are so eager to get this whole situation over with that they readily accept all the accusations and false promises. I assure you the Democratic cloud is without a silver lining. You(democrats) are all a bunch of snakes in the grass as far as I'm concerned. In either case now your stuck with a divided country and a divided government that nobody has any confidence in so the second the people realize that the democrats aren't going to solve their problems the gloves will come off. Good luck cause were all going to need it.

This officially proves that there is nothing left you can’t sue for. You can sue for anything now. Anything.

1) American isn’t ruined
2) Many Republicans were tired of the Republicans who failed to act like conservatives
3) Republicans bash Democrats just as much
4) Go away.

Somebloke · Joined: 08 May 2006 Posts: 2380 Location: London

Let's not forget 5) snakes are cool.

The Grandmaster · Posted: Mon Nov 13, 2006 12:32 pm Post subject:

Somebloke wrote: Let's not forget 5) snakes are cool.

I agree. I think Spiders are even cooler, despite being terrified of them.

Somebloke · Joined: 08 May 2006 Posts: 2380 Location: London

The Grandmaster wrote: Somebloke wrote: Let's not forget 5) snakes are cool.

I agree. I think Spiders are even cooler, despite being terrified of them.

Come to Australia, live in a house in a Bush area and then try telling me that huntsmen are cool. They aren't especially when they ambush 10-year old boys just coming out of the shower.

Even today in Britain I still check the walls after I remember that.

wyldejackyl · Joined: 10 Apr 2006 Posts: 7137 Location: Chicago, IL

Somebloke wrote: Let's not forget 5) snakes are cool.

Already took care of it:

I don't trust any politician..well, almost all of them. I am sick of the two-party system though, I'm sick of people that lie and cheat and are in bed with big business holding positions of power for the gain of themselves and their cronies. I'm waiting for a government to evolve where everyone has their freedom to do what they want so long as it doesn't infringe on others, common sense comes back to us as a people, and we all stay out of the fights in the world that don't count.