Political Crossfire Forums

[MoscowMatt]

The Russian army uses a similar idea to boost moral etc.

From Wikipedia


Miss Russian Army is a beauty contest held by the Russian army in which female soldiers compete for a title of the same name. It is admittedly staged for the purposes of increasing interest in and recruitment for the army among young men.

While in the Soviet era there was a similar contest called "Miss Red Star", the more recent incarnation was organized in 2003.


Ksenya Agarkova, winner of Miss Russian Army 2005In June 2005, nineteen female soldiers and sailors participated in the competition (entitled "Beauties in Shoulder Straps"), which was broadcast on live television. The event, held at Moscow's Russian Army Theatre, included the soldiers walking down the catwalk in uniform and singing songs while accompanied by guitarists (a memorable lyric included the phrases, "Since we're soldiers, our first concern is automatic weapons; boys come second"). A children's choir sang a song called "Our Army Is the Strongest". Other events, shown on film, saw the contestants competing in drills, crawling in combat uniform, entering tanks, and running with automatic weapons. (Defense officials prohibited the wearing of bikinis.) Other film clips showed women in the ranks of the earlier Red Army and their role in Soviet-era wars. The jury ultimately gave the title to Lieutenant Ksenya Agarkova, an engineer with Russia's Northern Fleet. Her image will be reproduced on a poster.

Officials were quite open about the hoped-for propaganda and recruiting value of the contest. Colonel Gennady Dzyuba, of the Defense Ministry, said, "Those who have served, especially in hot spots, know the importance of women — they calm the team down. We restrain ourselves in front of them, desist from coarseness." A former Miss Army said that because of the falling prestige of the Russian army, such a high-visibility contest makes men "want to join". Major General Nikolai Burbyga, the head juror, while expressing doubt over the recruiting benefits of the competition, admitted, "It kind of invigorates life — everyday life is very monotonous."

Quote: Defense officials prohibited the wearing of bikinis

Spoilsports!!! :lol:

[Superfly]

I said no. Too hard for women to get respect in the military as it is, without being treated like sex objects.

Also, once you sign on the dotted line, you become property of the US Guv'mint. I would think that this would fall along the same lines of not being able to get tattoos in certain areas - they own you for a while, and you hafta do what they say (or not do what they say), and quite frankly, there are just some things that are tacky, and shouldn't be done by people representing our country.

If you wanna see naked women, I'm sure that there is no shortage of nudie magazines full of women who have no self-respect whatsoever.

If you wanna see naked women holding AK-47s, go find Wolverine. He's the resident gun-a-holic, and he probably has tons of links.

:-D

[TNBiologist]

bigstick61 wrote: Quote: Bad for discipline. Once out of the military, do whatever you want, but while in, you should conduct yourself decorously.

I second this. Doing it shows a lack of discipline and pride in the service, and also results in bad PR for the service. While in, you are not free to whatever it is that you wish; everyone with half a brain knows this when they sign the papers or accept their commission or appointment. Morals and discipline are essential in the armed forces.

My thoughts exactly.

[Snake]

other, indifferent.

[Kilo Tango]

Rankor and Pissing wrote:

However, I'm still a guy (ie. men are pigs) and I'd still like to view the photos ... :wink: :-D

but yeah, this stuff shouldn't be tolerated. The military exists on discipline and this is certainly a breach of conduct.

[00timh]

Once a person enters the military they have accepted a different set of rules regarding conduct then a civilian. If the DOD says that military members are not to publicly show nude pictures, that is the way it is.

In a similar way, certain activities can be cause for termination by a private company. If the DOD feels that military members is not in the best interest of the military they can ban such activities. As a soldier, or sailor a certain appearance must be maintained. A person who becomes obese will be discharged. By joining the military you voluntarily give up certain rights, that is the way it has been and the way it will be for the foreseeable future. as much as people may feel that the military should allow openly gay people, exhibitionists and protesters, it is not their say in the matter, and shouldn't be.

[wyldejackyl]

This thread is worthless without pics. I mean, come on. Post the pics and let us be the judge of what should be shown and not be shown! :D

[justathought]

Being what many would consider a Dirty Old man. My first reaction was....WHERE ARE THE PICTURES.
On the other hand. Just imagine being the father, or mother of a female soldier who worries about their safety in real world terms, then learns that nude photos of that same daughter, sister, or wife are all over the internet.
Realistically. From a military point of view, not discussed here. Anyone in the Military, male or female who does such a thing places themself in a compromising position where they open themselves up for possible extortion, or blackmail personally, and they become targets of any enemy who will attempt to gain Information, possibly classified information in return for keeping the photos Secret.
While anyone is in uniform. They operate according the the UCMJ which covers, and determines their actions across the board.

[Snake]

justathought wrote: ...Just imagine being the father, or mother of a female soldier who worries about their safety in real world terms, then learns that nude photos of that same daughter, sister, or wife are all over the internet.... Like the mothers and fathers of the chicks in girls gone wild? This is no different, just because they're in the military doesn't mean they can't act a little slutty, they're in the military, they've earned the right to bare skin

[justathought]

Kamel wrote: justathought wrote: ...Just imagine being the father, or mother of a female soldier who worries about their safety in real world terms, then learns that nude photos of that same daughter, sister, or wife are all over the internet.... Like the mothers and fathers of the chicks in girls gone wild? This is no different, just because they're in the military doesn't mean they can't act a little slutty, they're in the military, they've earned the right to bare skin

Kamel: Yeah, they may have earned the right to bare skin. But, unlike civilians who have nothing to lose. In the military, if you break the rules, you pay for it with loss of pay, restrictions, military court, and sometimes OTH, or Dishonorable discharges. It's called going by the rules, obeying the rules, and knowing the differences between right and wrong.

[Korimyr the Rat]

I think it should be allowed.

While I agree with other posters absolutely that soliders should be held to high standards of honorable and decorous conduct, I do not believe that suggestive photographs or tasteful nudes violate this.

They are a symbol of pride, and of strength, and of security-- just as allowing our women onto the battlefield in the first place is. All we are doing is allowing our female soldiers to demonstrate their superiority to the timid and oppressed women of our enemies... and proving that sexuality is not mutually exclusive with military prowess.

And that should be encouraged.

I am also in absolute agreement that we should not allow our soldiers to degrade themselves for money.

[Snake]

justathought wrote: Kamel: Yeah, they may have earned the right to bare skin. But, unlike civilians who have nothing to lose. In the military, if you break the rules, you pay for it with loss of pay, restrictions, military court, and sometimes OTH, or Dishonorable discharges. It's called going by the rules, obeying the rules, and knowing the differences between right and wrong.

Hardly, civilians have plenty to lose if they break the rules of civilian life. when you break the rules at work, your pay is suspended, you get suspended from work or put on a probation system, or even fired, Break the rules outside of work, i.e. the law, you get sent to jail, put on trial, put on probation, house arrest, sent to prison etc. The people in the military are people, with lives and personalities, wants, needs, and desires, just like like you or me. Wish I could change my vote to YES now.

[justathought]

Kamel: I have 30 years of military experience behind me. So, I tend to have some knowledge about the UCMJ. Yes, females in the military are just like every other woman. However. Like it or not. The military operates on much higher standards than the civilian world, which includes obeying the RULES. In case you didn't know. The military is not a Democracy. In order to maintain discipline, and unquestionable responsibility, with a code of honor. Like it or not. There is no difference between men and women while in uniform. That's how woman prefer it to be. So, all things being equal, as they demand. The UCMJ applies to all despite their feelings, emotions, or willingness to be treated like civilians.
We should all be thankful for that. Which is why both Men, and Women in uniform cannot, and should not compromise their devotion to duty, and country, merely because something feels good. In other words. The military has rules that MUST be followed, which also includes what men and women do, while out of uniform, and in the civilian world. They are Military 24 hours a day, 7 days a week, 365 days a year.

[Snake]

I fail to see how doing a little strip tease for the camera constitutes lack of devotion to duty.

[Thrilla]

bigstick61 wrote: Quote: Bad for discipline. Once out of the military, do whatever you want, but while in, you should conduct yourself decorously.

I second this. Doing it shows a lack of discipline and pride in the service, and also results in bad PR for the service. While in, you are not free to whatever it is that you wish; everyone with half a brain knows this when they sign the papers or accept their commission or appointment. Morals and discipline are essential in the armed forces. :tu:...I second your seconding

[Richard Owl Mirror]

I would have to ask: Will they be posing with Iraqi prisoners?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/media/images/40120000/jpg/_40120905_iraq_pow_abuse123_ap.jpg

http://www.bintjbeil.com/articles/2004/images/abugraib11.jpg