Political Crossfire Forums

[Lucky Luke]

private_citizen wrote: Lucky Luke wrote: private_citizen wrote: Lucky Luke wrote: private_citizen wrote:

"if it did something I would love to know what it did"

I will tell you what it did, it scared the living crap out of the guy. Just his knowing I had it, and was not afraid to utilize it to decapitate his little pedro, was enough.
Had it NOT been there, he would have commensed his attack and I would have been powerless to stop it. You do not need to fire a gun to use it as a weapon of self defense.

The gun was in the purse, stayed in the purse and yet managed to save your life you are claiming. How Private_Citizen? What did the gun do that any unarmed person could have done with an empty purse?

Have you got a CCW permit?
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Your damn right I have a CCW permit, in fact it is laminated and in my purse, right next to the sewn in holster.



How friggen technical do you want to get LL? What next, are you going to ask what brand of ammo?
Now I think you are just picking bones.

I was just checking that you acted legally Private_Citizen.

Now you said the gun saved your life.

But you said the gun stayed in your purse?!

And what make you think that you were going to be killed anyway?

Your story just doesn't make sense Private_Citizen.

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I would prefer NOT to get into details with anyone as to what happened and did not happen that day. Any man who would want details on what happened makes me uncomfortable.

Then don't bring your personal life here if you are not ready to discuss it, easy.

This is a gun control debate, emotion and feelings are better out of it.

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[Lucky Luke]

Kamel wrote: Guns deter criminals because, like the rest of us, they don't want to get shot

If they did America would have a hell less criminals than we have, a hell less gun crimes and empty prisons.
This is not the case but for most parts of it the contrary.

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[The Comrade]

Lucky Luke wrote: Kamel wrote: Guns deter criminals because, like the rest of us, they don't want to get shot

If they did America would have a hell less criminals than we have, a hell less gun crimes and empty prisons.
This is not the case but for most parts of it the contrary.


because most Americans don't have a permit to carry a weapon with them where ever they go.

[Lucky Luke]

sailorman126 wrote: ll
once again you just attack anyone that knows that a gun can save a life r stop a crime.
you either cant read english very well or you intentionaly misread to make up the bs you post to back up your claims.
as for you pretending that private citiznes gun did not stop a crime on her is just pathetic.
you where not there she was she says that her having a gun saved her from an attack so why are you calling her a liar?
what proof do you have that she is lieing?
i know many people that have used a gun in self defense with out firing a shot. examples chambering a round into the shot gun has stoped crimes.
but i bet you will deny that also and call me a liar. becaseu that is all you do.

If guns were saving lives or stopping crimes like you suggest we would know about it just at looking at the murder rate and other crime rates in America. The picture is very different that what you are suggesting Sailorman126.

I won't call you any names but I'll suggest that you have a look at this:

Quote:

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[Lucky Luke]

The Comrade wrote: Lucky Luke wrote: Kamel wrote: Guns deter criminals because, like the rest of us, they don't want to get shot

If they did America would have a hell less criminals than we have, a hell less gun crimes and empty prisons.
This is not the case but for most parts of it the contrary.


because most Americans don't have a permit to carry a weapon with them where ever they go.

Still Americans have a lot more handguns for "protection" than any people living in the rest of the western democratic world. In fact America has the largest number of CCW permit holders in the western democratic world, what is happening The Comrade, why isn't it working like some are claiming here it is?

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[Lucky Luke]

The Comrade wrote: Lucky Luke wrote: wyldejackyl wrote: I don't think she ever said she was going to be killed. She said, "violent crime." My best guess would be rape. While not as bad as death in some people's eyes..it comes pretty close as you have to live with the consequences for the rest of your life. LL, are you saying that unless direct death is threatened, that a lawfully carrying citizen doesn't have a right to defend herself with a firearm? I can think of many horrible things that aren't death...

I don't do guesses, if someone comes here with an argument he/she better tell us what he/she means.

Having a .38 in my purse saved me LL said Private_Citizen I disagree. Had she said she felt safer because she had a gun in her purse I would have understood.

that doesn't make any sense. your entire argument has broken down, so now you turn the argument into a battle of semantics

No, I challenged some poster who made a wild comment on how a gun in a purse saved her.

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[The Comrade]

Lucky Luke wrote:
Still Americans have a lot more handguns for "protection" than any people living in the rest of the western democratic world. In fact America has the largest number of CCW permit holders in the western democratic world, what is happening The Comrade, why isn't it working like some are claiming here it is?

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how many violent gun crimes are committed against legal gun owners? dig up that statistic and maybe it'll answer your question.

[Lucky Luke]

The Comrade wrote: Lucky Luke wrote:
Still Americans have a lot more handguns for "protection" than any people living in the rest of the western democratic world. In fact America has the largest number of CCW permit holders in the western democratic world, what is happening The Comrade, why isn't it working like some are claiming here it is?

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how many violent gun crimes are committed against legal gun owners? dig up that statistic and maybe it'll answer your question.

If you think such statistic exists, dig it up yourself The Comrade. You back up your own claims and I back up my own ones okay?

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[The Comrade]

Lucky Luke wrote:
If you think such statistic exists, dig it up yourself The Comrade. You back up your own claims and I back up my own ones okay?


but you're the one claiming that americans have the most legal gun owners of any country, yet there is more violant crime here. i believe the burden of proof is on you.

[Lucky Luke]

The Comrade wrote: Lucky Luke wrote:
If you think such statistic exists, dig it up yourself The Comrade. You back up your own claims and I back up my own ones okay?


but you're the one claiming that americans have the most legal gun owners of any country, yet there is more violant crime here. i believe the burden of proof is on you.

I never claimed that the fact that Americans have the most legal gun owners of any western democratic country means that there is more violent crimes in America The Comrade.

I even never claimed that America has more violent crimes than other western democratic countries, in fact I stated in more than one occasion that America has a similar level of violent crimes than the rest of the democratic western world despite the claim of some here that the number of guns in America means that Americans are safer than others, they clearly aren't.

Deal with your own claims The Comrade, ready whenever you are.

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[private_citizen]

Lucky Luke wrote: private_citizen wrote: Lucky Luke wrote: private_citizen wrote: Lucky Luke wrote: private_citizen wrote:

"if it did something I would love to know what it did"

I will tell you what it did, it scared the living crap out of the guy. Just his knowing I had it, and was not afraid to utilize it to decapitate his little pedro, was enough.
Had it NOT been there, he would have commensed his attack and I would have been powerless to stop it. You do not need to fire a gun to use it as a weapon of self defense.

The gun was in the purse, stayed in the purse and yet managed to save your life you are claiming. How Private_Citizen? What did the gun do that any unarmed person could have done with an empty purse?

Have you got a CCW permit?
:-D
:-D


Your damn right I have a CCW permit, in fact it is laminated and in my purse, right next to the sewn in holster.



How friggen technical do you want to get LL? What next, are you going to ask what brand of ammo?
Now I think you are just picking bones.

I was just checking that you acted legally Private_Citizen.

Now you said the gun saved your life.

But you said the gun stayed in your purse?!

And what make you think that you were going to be killed anyway?

Your story just doesn't make sense Private_Citizen.

:-D
:-D

I would prefer NOT to get into details with anyone as to what happened and did not happen that day. Any man who would want details on what happened makes me uncomfortable.

Then don't bring your personal life here if you are not ready to discuss it, easy.

This is a gun control debate, emotion and feelings are better out of it.

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NO!! You said guns cannot save lives, I said they can and did.

I do NOT need to provide details, unless of course you are calling me a liar.

[Lucky Luke]

private_citizen wrote:


NO!! You said guns cannot save lives, I said they can and did.

I do NOT need to provide details, unless of course you are calling me a liar.

What kind of debate do you think you are having, claiming things are true but refusing to back them up?

You don't want to discuss your argument that makes you think that a gun saved your life, fine but don't come and tell us that we should trust whatever you are saying.

You did not show us that a gun saved your life, you have only claimed that it did, not good enough Private_Citizen, try again.

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[private_citizen]

Lucky Luke wrote: private_citizen wrote:


NO!! You said guns cannot save lives, I said they can and did.

I do NOT need to provide details, unless of course you are calling me a liar.

What kind of debate do you think you are having, claiming things are true but refusing to back them up?

You don't want to discuss your argument that makes you think that a gun saved your life, fine but don't come and tell us that we should trust whatever you are saying.

You did not show us that a gun saved your life, you have only claimed that it did, not good enough Private_Citizen, try again.

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OK, you want "details"

I was violently raped... beaten and left for dead on the side of the road when I was 17 I was strangled to the point I had a broken hyloid bone which perferated my layrnx and will never sing again ( I was in chorus).. so I decided from the time I was old enough I would defend myself. I now carry. just recently a man approached me in a grocery store parking lot and tried to pull me into a van, I grabbed my purse and said "I HAVE A .38 AND I WILL KILL YOU.." as I started to grab it out, he let me go.. immediately.

does that make you feel better?? Would you prefer to see the police reports?

You know, sometimes a gun CAN save your life, even if you DON'T have to use it!

[Lucky Luke]

private_citizen wrote: Lucky Luke wrote: private_citizen wrote:


NO!! You said guns cannot save lives, I said they can and did.

I do NOT need to provide details, unless of course you are calling me a liar.

What kind of debate do you think you are having, claiming things are true but refusing to back them up?

You don't want to discuss your argument that makes you think that a gun saved your life, fine but don't come and tell us that we should trust whatever you are saying.

You did not show us that a gun saved your life, you have only claimed that it did, not good enough Private_Citizen, try again.

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OK, you want "details"

I was violently raped... beaten and left for dead on the side of the road when I was 17 I was strangled to the point I had a broken hyloid bone which perferated my layrnx and will never sing again ( I was in chorus).. so I decided from the time I was old enough I would defend myself. I now carry. just recently a man approached me in a grocery store parking lot and tried to pull me into a van, I grabbed my purse and said "I HAVE A .38 AND I WILL KILL YOU.." as I started to grab it out, he let me go.. immediately.

does that make you feel better?? Would you prefer to see the police reports?

You know, sometimes a gun CAN save your life, even if you DON'T have to use it!

I did not want details Private_Citizen, I wanted you to understand that in forums like this one claims should be backed up if one expects to be trusted.

Instead of trusting some guns in a purse to help you Private_Citizen, you should ask yourself in what kind of society do you live where women are treated this way. What make you think that women in America are safer from male rapists because of guns? Do you know what gender has all the guns in America? The Switzerland example is proving that a gun in the home will be for the man to use and to often to use to threaten his female partner.

There is a big difference stating that a gun can save your life and that a gun saved your life Private_Citizen, a difference that most gun owners seem to be unable to comprehend.
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[Mikate8]

Yea, Europe and America are totally different countries. Different economies, cultures, people and many other things. Like in our country we're allowed to own guns. Lucky Luke, if you don't like guns move to europe, oh wait you're already there. The police in england don't even carry guns yet they still have a police force that has guns for when there are criminals that are armed. Hey wait a minute, I thought those gun laws in england we're supposed to get rid of them all.

Also, Guns do deter criminals. If a criminal had a choice of robbing an occupied house, one the owner owns lots of guns, the second house has none. Which house will he choose to rob? (Its a rhetorical question LL)

[Lucky Luke]

Mikate8 wrote: Yea, Europe and America are totally different countries. Different economies, cultures, people and many other things. Like in our country we're allowed to own guns. Lucky Luke, if you don't like guns move to europe, oh wait you're already there. The police in england don't even carry guns yet they still have a police force that has guns for when there are criminals that are armed. Hey wait a minute, I thought those gun laws in england we're supposed to get rid of them all.

Also, Guns do deter criminals. If a criminal had a choice of robbing an occupied house, one the owner owns lots of guns, the second house has none. Which house will he choose to rob? (Its a rhetorical question LL)

Canada is the place you should move to, I live in a very violent country and yet we are 2 to 3 times less likely to kill one another than Americans!

Would you like to compare what house is safer from robbery, the British one or the American one?

And before you start with talking about how Europe is different, think Canada.

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[private_citizen]

Lucky Luke wrote: private_citizen wrote: Lucky Luke wrote: private_citizen wrote:


NO!! You said guns cannot save lives, I said they can and did.

I do NOT need to provide details, unless of course you are calling me a liar.

What kind of debate do you think you are having, claiming things are true but refusing to back them up?

You don't want to discuss your argument that makes you think that a gun saved your life, fine but don't come and tell us that we should trust whatever you are saying.

You did not show us that a gun saved your life, you have only claimed that it did, not good enough Private_Citizen, try again.

:-D
:-D

OK, you want "details"

I was violently raped... beaten and left for dead on the side of the road when I was 17 I was strangled to the point I had a broken hyloid bone which perferated my layrnx and will never sing again ( I was in chorus).. so I decided from the time I was old enough I would defend myself. I now carry. just recently a man approached me in a grocery store parking lot and tried to pull me into a van, I grabbed my purse and said "I HAVE A .38 AND I WILL KILL YOU.." as I started to grab it out, he let me go.. immediately.

does that make you feel better?? Would you prefer to see the police reports?

You know, sometimes a gun CAN save your life, even if you DON'T have to use it!

I did not want details Private_Citizen, I wanted you to understand that in forums like this one claims should be backed up if one expects to be trusted.

Instead of trusting some guns in a purse to help you Private_Citizen, you should ask yourself in what kind of society do you live where women are treated this way. What make you think that women in America are safer from male rapists because of guns? Do you know what gender has all the guns in America? The Switzerland example is proving that a gun in the home will be for the man to use and to often to use to threaten his female partner.

There is a big difference stating that a gun can save your life and that a gun saved your life Private_Citizen, a difference that most gun owners seem to be unable to comprehend.
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I was raped in Montreal, 300 miles from where I live, and in a different country, I was visiting the BioDome and Olympic stadium

Where I live is very safe... in fact my home state was voted one of the top three safest in the nation! Where I have been assaulted and confronted has never been at home, bur rather abroad ( just to show that Europe is not safe, my mother in law, who is now a Carmelite Nun was on a religious sabbatical in Rome and she was mugged, so... go figure.)
But what I find MOST upsetting, is your use of happy smiley faces when respond to me..

[private_citizen]

Lucky Luke wrote: Mikate8 wrote: Yea, Europe and America are totally different countries. Different economies, cultures, people and many other things. Like in our country we're allowed to own guns. Lucky Luke, if you don't like guns move to europe, oh wait you're already there. The police in england don't even carry guns yet they still have a police force that has guns for when there are criminals that are armed. Hey wait a minute, I thought those gun laws in england we're supposed to get rid of them all.

Also, Guns do deter criminals. If a criminal had a choice of robbing an occupied house, one the owner owns lots of guns, the second house has none. Which house will he choose to rob? (Its a rhetorical question LL)

Canada is the place you should move to, I live in a very violent country and yet we are 2 to 3 times less likely to kill one another than Americans!

Would you like to compare what house is safer from robbery, the British one or the American one?

And before you start with talking about how Europe is different, think Canada.

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Montreal, is in Canada.

[Lucky Luke]

private_citizen wrote: Lucky Luke wrote: Mikate8 wrote: Yea, Europe and America are totally different countries. Different economies, cultures, people and many other things. Like in our country we're allowed to own guns. Lucky Luke, if you don't like guns move to europe, oh wait you're already there. The police in england don't even carry guns yet they still have a police force that has guns for when there are criminals that are armed. Hey wait a minute, I thought those gun laws in england we're supposed to get rid of them all.

Also, Guns do deter criminals. If a criminal had a choice of robbing an occupied house, one the owner owns lots of guns, the second house has none. Which house will he choose to rob? (Its a rhetorical question LL)

Canada is the place you should move to, I live in a very violent country and yet we are 2 to 3 times less likely to kill one another than Americans!

Would you like to compare what house is safer from robbery, the British one or the American one?

And before you start with talking about how Europe is different, think Canada.

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Montreal, is in Canada.

Have you got any idea of what the murder rate of Montreal is Private_Citizen?

Here is a clue:

Quote: Seven Canadian and US cities were selected to compare homicide rates. Cities were matched for similarity in size and geographical location.
In all cases, the homicide rates of US cities were higher than their Canadian neighbors.
In 2000, Canada's rate of incarceration was 118 per 100,000 total population.
The US rate of incarceration was five to six times higher, yet American cities were much more dangerous than comparable Canadian cities

http://www.npb-cnlc.gc.ca/reports/pdf/pls_2002/08_e.htm

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[Lucky Luke]

private_citizen wrote:

I was raped in Montreal, 300 miles from where I live, and in a different country, I was visiting the BioDome and Olympic stadium

Where I live is very safe... in fact my home state was voted one of the top three safest in the nation! Where I have been assaulted and confronted has never been at home, bur rather abroad ( just to show that Europe is not safe, my mother in law, who is now a Carmelite Nun was on a religious sabbatical in Rome and she was mugged, so... go figure.)
But what I find MOST upsetting, is your use of happy smiley faces when respond to me..

Then you were very unlucky Private_Citizen and your life was certainly not in danger in Montreal, the city of 3 million people has a similar murder rate than your state!

So now instead of talking about your personal life as an argument that America is safer with all it's guns than Canada or Europe why don't you look at the facts?

I am happy and I can't help it.
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