Political Crossfire Forums

[Free Thinkr]

krims wrote: Uhh, sure... I don't even know what you the heck you're talking about.
Me, I'm assuming?

I'm talking about the fact that you concede your argument in the first sentence. It's best you don't prove anything, because Patriot will surely knock it down instantly. The only 'proof' you offer is assertion, and he will quickly destroy it with facts, the same as I would if only I had the mind-numbing patience that Patriot has. It's hilarious to me how conspiracy theorists in this forum accuse Patriot of being close-minded and of not considering any of their theories, because the time he puts into so thoroughly debunking them is, in my mind, basically a waste of time. I mean, I suppose it's for a good cause and all, but so much of what he debunks is debunked by simple consideration by those who have common sense and no agenda. His patience is legendary, in my mind. His opponents get so desperate, they literally claim that he's a government agent (I've only had this accusation lobbed at me once, but I've seen it lobbed at Patriot numerous times).

I once challenged people here to argue the JFK conspiracy with me. Guess what? No takers. Why? The reason is that the palookas know damn well that I'd decimate them in any structured debate. The same holds true with Patriot, were it not for the convenient excuse of ignoring him by simply declaring him to be a liar or government shill. If someone took me up on the JFK conspiracy, I'm sure I'd be a liar or a government shill in short order in my opponents' minds.

That's what I'm talking about. It's called reality and fact. Some people consider it.

[krims]

Sure, whatever you say...


Quote: I'm talking about the fact that you concede your argument in the first sentence. It's best you don't prove anything, because Patriot will surely knock it down instantly. The only 'proof' you offer is assertion, and he will quickly destroy it with facts, the same as I would if only I had the mind-numbing patience that Patriot has.

That's not what I meant at all. Once again you people twist the meaning of my words.

What I said was that "I'm not going to try to prove anything for your benefit just to have you knock it down."

This means it's best for me not to try to prove anything to you because you will act like you don't understand and pretend I'm saying something else or use some other dirty trick.

I don't need to prove anything because you already know what I mean. As far as everyone else is concerned, you should go back and examine everything people like Patriot911 have said with a critical eye.

[krims]

Quote: It's hilarious to me how conspiracy theorists in this forum accuse Patriot of being close-minded and of not considering any of their theories, because the time he puts into so thoroughly debunking them is, in my mind, basically a waste of time. I mean, I suppose it's for a good cause and all, but so much of what he debunks is debunked by simple consideration by those who have common sense and no agenda. His patience is legendary, in my mind.

I don't believe anybody asked him to do any of this, so I don't see why he's wasting his time and effort trying to disprove conspiracy theories. If it's really such a pain in the butt, then maybe he should stop it.

[Wizard From Oz]

Quote: I don't believe anybody asked him to do any of this, so I don't see why he's wasting his time and effort trying to disprove conspiracy theories. If it's really such a pain in the butt, then maybe he should stop it.

So more rubbish can be sprouted unopposed?

[krims]

If it's rubbish then don't bother with it, why are you making it your own problem? If it's rubbish then other people should see that it's rubbish too. Or do you not trust the judgement of other people?

[Wizard From Oz]

Quote: I don't believe anybody asked him to do any of this, so I don't see why he's wasting his time and effort trying to disprove conspiracy theories. If it's really such a pain in the butt, then maybe he should stop it.

People can only make an informed decsision when they are armed with as many sides of an issue as possible

[krims]

Then don't complain that people like Patriot911 are wasting their patience and time doing what they do.

[Wizard From Oz]

Quote: Then don't complain that people like Patriot911 are wasting their patience and time doing what they do

Show me where i did

[krims]

I'm talking about Free Thinkr and you people in general.

[Wizard From Oz]

Quote: I'm talking about Free Thinkr and you people in general.

So a sweeping generality rather than a direct observation

[krims]

Sure, whatever you say.... Why don't you actually scroll up to the top of this page and look at Free Thinkr's last post?

[Free Thinkr]

krims wrote: Sure, whatever you say...

Quote: I'm talking about the fact that you concede your argument in the first sentence. It's best you don't prove anything, because Patriot will surely knock it down instantly. The only 'proof' you offer is assertion, and he will quickly destroy it with facts, the same as I would if only I had the mind-numbing patience that Patriot has.

That's not what I meant at all. Once again you people twist the meaning of my words.

What I said was that "I'm not going to try to prove anything for your benefit just to have you knock it down."
No one's twisting your words. We can't read your mind; all we have to go by is what you wrote.

Quote: This means it's best for me not to try to prove anything to you because you will act like you don't understand and pretend I'm saying something else or use some other dirty trick.
That's an interesting meaning for "knock it down." Who's twisting whose words now?

Quote: I don't need to prove anything because you already know what I mean. As far as everyone else is concerned, you should go back and examine everything people like Patriot911 have said with a critical eye.
I've read quite a lot of what Patriot has written; I concede, like he does, that he pokes fun at you guys frequently and that he occasionally gets irritated and tells you guys off, but by and large, he responds to what is said point-by-point, and explains exactly why he doesn't find your theories to be convincing.

[NAB]

krims wrote: Sure, whatever you say.... Why don't you actually scroll up to the top of this page and look at Free Thinkr's last post?

You might learn to hit the "quote" button to reduce the level of confusion found in your posts. Unfortunately there's not a "content" button for you to use.

[Free Thinkr]

krims wrote: Quote: It's hilarious to me how conspiracy theorists in this forum accuse Patriot of being close-minded and of not considering any of their theories, because the time he puts into so thoroughly debunking them is, in my mind, basically a waste of time. I mean, I suppose it's for a good cause and all, but so much of what he debunks is debunked by simple consideration by those who have common sense and no agenda. His patience is legendary, in my mind.

I don't believe anybody asked him to do any of this, so I don't see why he's wasting his time and effort trying to disprove conspiracy theories. If it's really such a pain in the butt, then maybe he should stop it.
Obviously, he feels it worth the effort to expose these conspiracy theories for what they are. Upon consideration, I think the reason I don't have the patience to spend too much of my time on it is that this forum has a Patriot911, and I therefore don't need to.

[krims]

Quote: No one's twisting your words. We can't read your mind; all we have to go by is what you wrote.
How very strange, because everyone else seems to understand me perfectly fine.


Quote: That's an interesting meaning for "knock it down." Who's twisting whose words now?
Okay Shakespeare, what should I have used then?


Quote: I've read quite a lot of what Patriot has written; I concede, like he does, that he pokes fun at you guys frequently
Well I don't find any of his jokes funny, especially not the anti-semitic ones in that thread that was locked up yesterday for trolling.


Quote: Obviously, he feels it worth the effort to expose these conspiracy theories for what they are.
Then don't complain that he's wasting time on us!


Quote: You might learn to hit the "quote" button to reduce the level of confusion found in your posts. Unfortunately there's not a "content" button for you to use.
What? I don't get what you said about a "content" button.

[NAB]

krims wrote: Quote: No one's twisting your words. We can't read your mind; all we have to go by is what you wrote.
How very strange, because everyone else seems to understand me perfectly fine.


Quote: That's an interesting meaning for "knock it down." Who's twisting whose words now?
Okay Shakespeare, what should I have used then?


Quote: I've read quite a lot of what Patriot has written; I concede, like he does, that he pokes fun at you guys frequently
Well I don't find any of his jokes funny, especially not the anti-semitic ones in that thread that was locked up yesterday for trolling.


Quote: Obviously, he feels it worth the effort to expose these conspiracy theories for what they are.
Then don't complain that he's wasting time on us!


Quote: You might learn to hit the "quote" button to reduce the level of confusion found in your posts. Unfortunately there's not a "content" button for you to use.
What? I don't get what you said about a "content" button.

There's the rub.

[krims]

What?

[Patriot911]

:lol: It is amazing how someone can be respected and despised on the same board. Thank you for the kind words and sorry Krims, but I am not going anywhere just because you don't like what I have to say. If you want to go to a board where others just nod and agree with all your conspiracy theories, then there are plenty of sites out there that cater to your every nutty theory no matter how absurd.

HOWEVER, if you post it on a moderated board such as this one, you have to expect someone is going to look at your theories with a critical eye and point out the falacies. I personally take great offense at the mockery conspiracy theorists make of the events of 9/11. I've done the research. I've looked at the facts. I've watched the videos and I've visited the conspiracy sites. I've looked at the accusations and the theories from the barely believable to the totally outrageous.

Let me let you in on a little secret. Want to know why conspiracy theorists lack any kind of credibility? Two reasons. First is that they will support almost any conspiracy theory out there to the death. This thread is a perfect example. I've shown how the theory behind the threat assessment on Ashcroft debunks both the major theories out there. It is very common sense logic. Not a single person in five pages has made an attempt to address my points. Which, of course, is the second reason why conspiracy theorists lack any kind of credibility. They are great at making assertions, but suck ROYALLY at backing anything up or defending these theories when the flaws are pointed out. Why? I don't really know, but I do have a theory. Conspiracy theorists love the idea of there being a conspiracy, but are woefully unprepared when it comes to understanding the conspiracy and being able to defend it past the points spoon fed to them by the likes of Alex Jones.

The favorite tactic is attack the messenger. You do it. Norrin does it. Psholtz does it. Just about ever conspiracy theorist on this board does it. They can't defend their theories so they claim those that expose the theories as false are liars or spinners or government agents. Pretty pathetic actually.

Oh, and I am still waiting for an example of where I lied. As Gremlin and Psholtz have found out, I don't give up on a point once its been made until you either prove it or until you admit you either made the claim in error or lied about it. So far all your excuses for not producing the evidence have rung extremely hollow.

[krims]

Quote: Want to know why conspiracy theorists lack any kind of credibility? Two reasons. First is that they will support almost any conspiracy theory out there to the death.

You just lied right there.

Conspiracy theorists like me and psholtz only support what we truly believe, and the only way you have of disproving it is by showing us why we're wrong. So far we've explained ourselves many times in the hopes that you would understand us and we would find common ground. Instead we find that you resort to dirty tricks to make us look bad in front of everyone else. Well I know for a fact that I only argue for what I believe in, and you cannot get me to believe a lie about myself because I know myself better than any other person.

[Wizard From Oz]

Quote: Conspiracy theorists like me and psholtz only support what we truly believe, and the only way you have of disproving it is by showing us why we're wrong. So far we've explained ourselves many times in the hopes that you would understand us and we would find common ground. Instead we find that you resort to dirty tricks to make us look bad in front of everyone else.

However the problem becomes, even when it is clearly demonstrated that something about a conspiracy is incorrect, you press on as if the observation was never made.

Other elements of theories just dont make any sense, but still continue to be defended. Example, the pull it controversy. Now we have multiple levels of government involved in a conspiracy, literally hundreds of people needing to be coached controled and monitored to pull it of.

Yet one man makes this statement, that means the entire operation is compromised. And it is not hidden in some secret memo or unearthed by a nosey reporter. It is a matter of very public record.

What frustrates me the most is the real conspiracy issues. The real underhanded activites. The real unexplainable events are being ignored in favour of the these paper tigers