Political Crossfire Forums

Norrin Radd · Joined: 08 Aug 2005 Posts: 2930

Looks like I am about to be suspended, so I will see you all when I get back.

Have fun ripping on me while I am away.

Looks like I will be gone for 2 weeks.

Thanks to everyone who actually cares about the truth.

If the government had nothing to hide, they would not suppress so much evidence under the disguise of national security.

This is simple common sense.

See you in 2 weeks.

Todd D. · Posted: Mon Oct 09, 2006 2:23 pm Post subject:

Quote: Where are you from? Why don't you list a country in your profile?

Are you ashamed of where you come from?
Does it really matter where I am from? Besides, that big American Flag in my sig would probably be a clue to a rather astute observer.

Quote: Are you American? If yes, then you should know that the fidings of the Warren Commission are one of the most ridiculous theories ever presented.
Really? I'd put the following as "more ridiculous", in the grand scheme of things.
-Geocentrism.
-Flat Earth Society.
-The Vatican having a list of every Protestant in the world in a giant computer.
-Young Earth Creationism
-9/11 Inside Job
-Illuminati / Masons / Skull and Bones secretly ruling the world
-The Pope invented Islam to destroy Israel

Those are just off the top of my head. Those are ridiculous claims.

Quote: The single bullet theory is more preposterous than any of the 911 theories and only a moron would believe such a theory.
Cute. Of course, it lacks any substance behind such an accusation, and is no doubt based on the half-truths and outright lies that men like Jim Garrison spread in the 70's and 80's, not to mention the publicity such theory gathered from Oliver Stone's JFK, but that's cool. You are more than entitled to your opinion.

Quote: In this case, the poll numbers eflect the facts, as it has been long enough that the people see through the obvious lies and know that they were lied to by the government.
Of course, in THIS case they reflect the facts. When a majority of people think that the 9/11 attacks were carried out by Muslims, you decry it as how gullible and stupid Ameicans can be, but when it fits YOUR theory, it's proof of what you claim. That's what we call "a double standard".

NAB · Posted: Mon Oct 09, 2006 2:41 pm Post subject:

Norrin Radd wrote: NAB wrote: I thought handing out the Self-importance trophy would be enough for some, but it looks like they are now bucking for the Lifetime Achievement Award.

What's the max PSI for someone's head when they think they can dictate who should and shouldn't be an American?

Have you ever read the 87 page Senae report titled "Is Military Research Hazardous to Veteran's Health"?

Can you tell me about MKULTRA?

Can you tell me about the radiation experiments?

Can you tell me about the aerial dissemination of biological simulants?

Can you tell me how many families the government has compensated for human testing?

Can you tell me how many people are known to have been killed by US government testing?

Do you care about the crimes committed by the US government?

Can you tell me about the covert opeartions of the US government related to Cambodia, Laos, Chile, El Salvador, Nicaragua, or East Timor?

Do you care about all of these crimes committed by the US government?

If no, then you do not deserve to be an America.

Period.

So said the self-appointed Minister of Virtue and Righteousness.

The self-righteous feel no need to be charming, and thus double their offensiveness. Mason Cooley

Patriot911 · Joined: 03 Feb 2005 Posts: 6937 Location: Denver, CO

Norrin Radd wrote: Patriot911 wrote: Norrin Radd wrote:
Thanks.

JFK is another topic altogether This one conspiracy helps show what the government is truly capable of.

In 2004 FOX did a poll regarding the Kennedy assasination.

....66 percent of the public today think the assassination was “part of a larger conspiracy” while only 25 percent think it was the “act of one individual.” These new poll results are similar to previous surveys conducted by Louis Harris and Associates in 1967, 1975 and 1981, when about two-thirds also felt the shooting was part of a larger conspiracy.

The FOX News poll, conducted by Opinion Dynamics Corporation (search), also shows that most Americans (74 percent) think there was a cover-up of the facts about the assassination of JFK. Few people (14 percent) think “we know all the facts” and 12 percent are unsure.

74% of the American people believe there was a larger conspiracy regarding the assasination and only 25% believe it was the act of a lone individual.

This proves that at almost 3/4 of the American people believe the government was invovled in a coverup of the assasination of a sitting US president.

If a government is capable of covering up the assasination of it's own president, then what else is it capable of?

ANSWER: ANYTHING

Simple logic.

Anoyone who trusts anything the govenrment says is buried in denial and is simply not capable of logical thought.

Thank you for proving your lack of common sense by displaying it for everyone to see. 74% believe there was a larger conspiracy and you claim this is proof that they all believe the government did it. WRONG. Once again you assume you know everything while proving you know very little. "Larger conpsiracy" could be ANYTHING including just one more person. There are numerous conspiracy theories out there other than JFK being assassinated by the government, yet you dishonestly try and claim that not only all 74% of them believe the government was responsible but that somehow this PROVES the government was responsible and that this is reason not to trust the government. :roll:

You have a seriously twisted sense of what constitutes proof.

I didn't say anything about the "government doing it."

Once again you are spinning what I said.

What I posted was........

The FOX News poll, conducted by Opinion Dynamics Corporation (search), also shows that most Americans (74 percent) think there was a cover-up of the facts about the assassination of JFK.

COVER-UP does not mean the government did it, what that means is that the government lied about what really happened.

While I don't use poll numbers very often for anything, in this case, the poll numbers reflect the facts. I have yet to meet a single person who believes the "magic bullet theory."

Wow. You will lie even when the proof is in the very post I quoted. I highlighted it for you. I don't expect you to own up to this lie when you get back, but wanted to point it out since you made such a fuss over me supposedly spinning something you said when I clearly didn't.

Norrin Radd · Joined: 08 Aug 2005 Posts: 2930

Todd D. wrote:
Of course, in THIS case they reflect the facts. When a majority of people think that the 9/11 attacks were carried out by Muslims, you decry it as how gullible and stupid Ameicans can be, but when it fits YOUR theory, it's proof of what you claim. That's what we call "a double standard".

No, you obviously know little to nothing about what I believe and only assume things about me.

I already admitted in an earlier post that the government "might" not have had anyting to do with 911.

I never said anyone was stupid for believing the official story about 911, but people who dismiss all the many coincidences are stupid. You can believe the official story, but dismissing hundreds of coincidences is closed minded.

I believe the government "might" have had foreknowledge of the 911 attacks, but even if this is true, I belive the number of government officials involved is very small, much like the number was very small concerning foreknowledge of that attack on Pearl.

Anyways, I doubt I will be able to answer any more posts as my suspension will be starting soon.

Norrin Radd · Joined: 08 Aug 2005 Posts: 2930

NAB wrote: Norrin Radd wrote: NAB wrote: I thought handing out the Self-importance trophy would be enough for some, but it looks like they are now bucking for the Lifetime Achievement Award.

What's the max PSI for someone's head when they think they can dictate who should and shouldn't be an American?

Have you ever read the 87 page Senae report titled "Is Military Research Hazardous to Veteran's Health"?

Can you tell me about MKULTRA?

Can you tell me about the radiation experiments?

Can you tell me about the aerial dissemination of biological simulants?

Can you tell me how many families the government has compensated for human testing?

Can you tell me how many people are known to have been killed by US government testing?

Do you care about the crimes committed by the US government?

Can you tell me about the covert opeartions of the US government related to Cambodia, Laos, Chile, El Salvador, Nicaragua, or East Timor?

Do you care about all of these crimes committed by the US government?

If no, then you do not deserve to be an America.

Period.

So said the self-appointed Minister of Virtue and Righteousness.

The self-righteous feel no need to be charming, and thus double their offensiveness. Mason Cooley

Do you disagree?

How can you deserve to be an American if you do not care about innocent people who have been killed by your own government?

Norrin Radd · Joined: 08 Aug 2005 Posts: 2930

Patriot911 wrote: Norrin Radd wrote: Patriot911 wrote: Norrin Radd wrote:
Thanks.

JFK is another topic altogether This one conspiracy helps show what the government is truly capable of.

In 2004 FOX did a poll regarding the Kennedy assasination.

....66 percent of the public today think the assassination was “part of a larger conspiracy” while only 25 percent think it was the “act of one individual.” These new poll results are similar to previous surveys conducted by Louis Harris and Associates in 1967, 1975 and 1981, when about two-thirds also felt the shooting was part of a larger conspiracy.

The FOX News poll, conducted by Opinion Dynamics Corporation (search), also shows that most Americans (74 percent) think there was a cover-up of the facts about the assassination of JFK. Few people (14 percent) think “we know all the facts” and 12 percent are unsure.

74% of the American people believe there was a larger conspiracy regarding the assasination and only 25% believe it was the act of a lone individual.

This proves that at almost 3/4 of the American people believe the government was invovled in a coverup of the assasination of a sitting US president.

If a government is capable of covering up the assasination of it's own president, then what else is it capable of?

ANSWER: ANYTHING

Simple logic.

Anoyone who trusts anything the govenrment says is buried in denial and is simply not capable of logical thought.

Thank you for proving your lack of common sense by displaying it for everyone to see. 74% believe there was a larger conspiracy and you claim this is proof that they all believe the government did it. WRONG. Once again you assume you know everything while proving you know very little. "Larger conpsiracy" could be ANYTHING including just one more person. There are numerous conspiracy theories out there other than JFK being assassinated by the government, yet you dishonestly try and claim that not only all 74% of them believe the government was responsible but that somehow this PROVES the government was responsible and that this is reason not to trust the government. :roll:

You have a seriously twisted sense of what constitutes proof.

I didn't say anything about the "government doing it."

Once again you are spinning what I said.

What I posted was........

The FOX News poll, conducted by Opinion Dynamics Corporation (search), also shows that most Americans (74 percent) think there was a cover-up of the facts about the assassination of JFK.

COVER-UP does not mean the government did it, what that means is that the government lied about what really happened.

While I don't use poll numbers very often for anything, in this case, the poll numbers reflect the facts. I have yet to meet a single person who believes the "magic bullet theory."

Wow. You will lie even when the proof is in the very post I quoted. I highlighted it for you. I don't expect you to own up to this lie when you get back, but wanted to point it out since you made such a fuss over me supposedly spinning something you said when I clearly didn't.

God are you dumb. It says the government was involved IN A COVERUP not in the actual assasination.

Thanks for proving you are not even capable of simple comprehension.

****.

NAB · Posted: Mon Oct 09, 2006 4:21 pm Post subject:

Norrin Radd wrote: NAB wrote: Norrin Radd wrote: NAB wrote: I thought handing out the Self-importance trophy would be enough for some, but it looks like they are now bucking for the Lifetime Achievement Award.

What's the max PSI for someone's head when they think they can dictate who should and shouldn't be an American?

Have you ever read the 87 page Senae report titled "Is Military Research Hazardous to Veteran's Health"?

Can you tell me about MKULTRA?

Can you tell me about the radiation experiments?

Can you tell me about the aerial dissemination of biological simulants?

Can you tell me how many families the government has compensated for human testing?

Can you tell me how many people are known to have been killed by US government testing?

Do you care about the crimes committed by the US government?

Can you tell me about the covert opeartions of the US government related to Cambodia, Laos, Chile, El Salvador, Nicaragua, or East Timor?

Do you care about all of these crimes committed by the US government?

If no, then you do not deserve to be an America.

Period.

So said the self-appointed Minister of Virtue and Righteousness.

The self-righteous feel no need to be charming, and thus double their offensiveness. Mason Cooley

Do you disagree?

How can you deserve to be an American if you do not care about innocent people who have been killed by your own government?

Don't confuse having concern for the life of innocent people with having annoyance for those who "think" they have a lock on the truth and self-righteous indignation on their side. :wink:

Patriot911 · Joined: 03 Feb 2005 Posts: 6937 Location: Denver, CO

I find it curious you are still able to post and insult people while suspended...... :lol:

Funny how you claim others aren't capable of comprehension yet you fail to see that if the government is covering up then the government is indeed involved in the assassination. If I try to hide your guilt in a murder, I am an accessory to murder. You got caught once again lying and instead of being a man about it and admitting it, you try to spin it and make yourself look good. What you fail to comprehend is that when you are covered in sh*t, spreading it around doesn't make you look or smell any better.

And you still haven't addressed your initial dishonesty in claiming that the 74% of the people in the poll think the government is involved. All the poll says is 74% think there is a larger conspiracy. First rule of thumb when you find yourself in a hole is to quit digging. ;-)

Patriot911 · Joined: 03 Feb 2005 Posts: 6937 Location: Denver, CO

NAB wrote: Norrin Radd wrote: NAB wrote: Norrin Radd wrote: NAB wrote: I thought handing out the Self-importance trophy would be enough for some, but it looks like they are now bucking for the Lifetime Achievement Award.

What's the max PSI for someone's head when they think they can dictate who should and shouldn't be an American?

Have you ever read the 87 page Senae report titled "Is Military Research Hazardous to Veteran's Health"?

Can you tell me about MKULTRA?

Can you tell me about the radiation experiments?

Can you tell me about the aerial dissemination of biological simulants?

Can you tell me how many families the government has compensated for human testing?

Can you tell me how many people are known to have been killed by US government testing?

Do you care about the crimes committed by the US government?

Can you tell me about the covert opeartions of the US government related to Cambodia, Laos, Chile, El Salvador, Nicaragua, or East Timor?

Do you care about all of these crimes committed by the US government?

If no, then you do not deserve to be an America.

Period.

So said the self-appointed Minister of Virtue and Righteousness.

The self-righteous feel no need to be charming, and thus double their offensiveness. Mason Cooley

Do you disagree?

How can you deserve to be an American if you do not care about innocent people who have been killed by your own government?

Don't confuse having concern for the life of innocent people with having annoyance for those who "think" they have a lock on the truth and self-righteous indignation on their side. :wink:

Hey, NAB. Ever notice NR always talks about the government as though it is some kind of single entity? It isn't the people in the government that did these bad things, but the government as a whole.

This is key to his whole debating style because his only defense appears to be pointing at the actions of people in the past as proof that the government is doing something bad now. Never mind that the people who did the bad things in the past are not in the government or in power now. Never mind that many of the things he points to are not proven. Never mind that something unconnected happening in the past doesn't prove someone else did something at another time. If Norrin even THINKS they've done it before then that is proof enough for him to accuse them of doing it now. :roll:

NAB · Posted: Mon Oct 09, 2006 5:26 pm Post subject:

Patriot911 wrote: NAB wrote: Norrin Radd wrote: NAB wrote: Norrin Radd wrote: NAB wrote: I thought handing out the Self-importance trophy would be enough for some, but it looks like they are now bucking for the Lifetime Achievement Award.

What's the max PSI for someone's head when they think they can dictate who should and shouldn't be an American?

Have you ever read the 87 page Senae report titled "Is Military Research Hazardous to Veteran's Health"?

Can you tell me about MKULTRA?

Can you tell me about the radiation experiments?

Can you tell me about the aerial dissemination of biological simulants?

Can you tell me how many families the government has compensated for human testing?

Can you tell me how many people are known to have been killed by US government testing?

Do you care about the crimes committed by the US government?

Can you tell me about the covert opeartions of the US government related to Cambodia, Laos, Chile, El Salvador, Nicaragua, or East Timor?

Do you care about all of these crimes committed by the US government?

If no, then you do not deserve to be an America.

Period.

So said the self-appointed Minister of Virtue and Righteousness.

The self-righteous feel no need to be charming, and thus double their offensiveness. Mason Cooley

Do you disagree?

How can you deserve to be an American if you do not care about innocent people who have been killed by your own government?

Don't confuse having concern for the life of innocent people with having annoyance for those who "think" they have a lock on the truth and self-righteous indignation on their side. :wink:

Hey, NAB. Ever notice NR always talks about the government as though it is some kind of single entity? It isn't the people in the government that did these bad things, but the government as a whole.

This is key to his whole debating style because his only defense appears to be pointing at the actions of people in the past as proof that the government is doing something bad now. Never mind that the people who did the bad things in the past are not in the government or in power now. Never mind that many of the things he points to are not proven. Never mind that something unconnected happening in the past doesn't prove someone else did something at another time. If Norrin even THINKS they've done it before then that is proof enough for him to accuse them of doing it now. :roll:

I agree with you on trying to see the Government as a single super-entity, but it does make grandstanding rhetoric that much easier. :wink:

krims · Joined: 25 May 2006 Posts: 136 Location: kamchatka

Wow... where's the justice. It's people like Patriot911 that should be suspended. People like Patriot911 are either ridiculously stupid and unable to comprehend anyone who they disagree with on the same *wavelength*, or they are malicious liars to the core whose only goal is to confuse and ruin honest discussion by any means.

Patriot911 · Joined: 03 Feb 2005 Posts: 6937 Location: Denver, CO

krims wrote: Wow... where's the justice. It's people like Patriot911 that should be suspended. People like Patriot911 are either ridiculously stupid and unable to comprehend anyone who they disagree with on the same *wavelength*, or they are malicious liars to the core whose only goal is to confuse and ruin honest discussion by any means.

Nice personal attack Krims.

OK, you've made the accusations. Now prove it. I've posted my positions and logic. Refute them. Show all of us just how smart you are. Point out my lies. Point out how I am wrong.

I love it when 9/11 deniers set themselves up to look like a complete idiot, although I doubt Krims will have the cajones to actually attempt this.

krims · Joined: 25 May 2006 Posts: 136 Location: kamchatka

No, I'm not going to play your little game. Everyone here knows exactly what I mean and the reasons why I said it. If I try to prove it, you'll just do the same thing you've been doing the whole time and twist the meaning, turn it into something personal, act ignorant, and go out on a random tangent.

Patriot911 · Joined: 03 Feb 2005 Posts: 6937 Location: Denver, CO

krims wrote: No, I'm not going to play your little game. Everyone here knows exactly what I mean and the reasons why I said it. If I try to prove it, you'll just do the same thing you've been doing the whole time and twist the meaning, turn it into something personal, act ignorant, and go out on a random tangent.

Yup. Typical and I called it. You can't refute what I've said or point out the "lies". You're just upset because you can't. Why? Because I don't lie for one thing. Second, the logic I use to come to my conclusions is sound.

So go ahead and run away after throwing insults. I think I saw someone like you at the zoo recently. A bunch of little monkey's throwing feces around and then running away. Thanks for proving just what kind of gutless wonder you are. It doesn't take a lot of guts to level baseless accusations but it takes a man of integrity to back them up. When I call someone a liar, I back it up with proof. When I say someone is wrong or spinning, I show exactly why. When I say someone's logic is faulty, I prove it.

krims · Joined: 25 May 2006 Posts: 136 Location: kamchatka

I'm not going to try to prove anything for your benefit just to have you knock it down. Everything that needs to be said has already been said. Let people read what we wrote and judge for themselves. Let them see how you constantly throw unnecessary personal insults at everyone who disagrees with you. Let them see what Norrin Radd was trying to say and let them see how you tried to twist the meaning and intention of everything he said.

NAB · Posted: Tue Oct 10, 2006 10:09 am Post subject:

krims wrote: I'm not going to try to prove anything for your benefit just to have you knock it down. Everything that needs to be said has already been said. Let people read what we wrote and judge for themselves. Let them see how you constantly throw unnecessary personal insults at everyone who disagrees with you. Let them see what Norrin Radd was trying to say and let them see how you tried to twist the meaning and intention of everything he said.

The bolded part speaks volumes. :wink:

Patriot911 · Joined: 03 Feb 2005 Posts: 6937 Location: Denver, CO

krims wrote: I'm not going to try to prove anything for your benefit just to have you knock it down. Everything that needs to be said has already been said. Let people read what we wrote and judge for themselves. Let them see how you constantly throw unnecessary personal insults at everyone who disagrees with you. Let them see what Norrin Radd was trying to say and let them see how you tried to twist the meaning and intention of everything he said.

Don't do it for my benefit. Do it to prove your integrity. You've made claims against me, yet you can't back them up. Should be simple enough, right? Well, it would be simple if they were true..... but we both know you made those claims knowing they weren't true. What does that make you again? :lol:

Quit trying to hide behind the "everyone knows it" BS. Either take back your claims or prove them. Unlike the conspiracy theories, this is a proveable accusation.

If you still refuse, it only shows people what kind of integrity that you have. Monkeys go around throwing s**t and then running away. A man will back up what he says. Which are you?

I saw what Norrin was trying to say, and unlike you, I debated him on it. He refused to debate the actual issue and instead tried to deflect the issue to past instances and conspiracy theories. When that failed, he broke down into pure personal attacks with no merit. When THAT failed, he sunk even lower by claiming people should die.

Would you like to take up the banner and show us how the Ashcroft threat assessment could be tied to 9/11 without debunking the government was behind 9/11 or the government knew about 9/11 theories? Given the facts, it can't be done. If you say the government was behind 9/11, why would they expose their plans via some "threat assessment"? If the government knew Al Qaeda was up to something and turned a blind eye to it, why only Ashcroft? Why not Rice? Powell? Or anyone else on Bush's cabinet? And why for the remainder of his term? Telling him the threat was only for 2001 would have done it.

Free Thinkr · Posted: Tue Oct 10, 2006 1:27 pm Post subject:

NAB wrote: krims wrote: I'm not going to try to prove anything for your benefit just to have you knock it down. Everything that needs to be said has already been said. Let people read what we wrote and judge for themselves. Let them see how you constantly throw unnecessary personal insults at everyone who disagrees with you. Let them see what Norrin Radd was trying to say and let them see how you tried to twist the meaning and intention of everything he said.

The bolded part speaks volumes. :wink:
LOL, no doubt. Talk about bringing a knife to a gunfight.

krims · Joined: 25 May 2006 Posts: 136 Location: kamchatka

Uhh, sure... I don't even know what you the heck you're talking about.