Political Crossfire Forums

[RyzinEnagy]

http://www.defenselink.mil/news/NewsArticle.aspx?ID=1289

Quote: Iranian Government Behind Shipping Weapons to Iraq
By Jim Garamone
American Forces Press Service

WASHINGTON, Sept. 28, 2006 – The Iranian government is behind shipping components used to make improvised explosive devices to Iraqi insurgents, a senior intelligence official in Iraq said yesterday.

Labels on weapons stocks seized inside and outside Iraq point to Iranian government complicity in arming Shiite militias in Iraq, Army Maj. Gen. Richard Zahner, the deputy chief of staff for intelligence with Multinational Force Iraq, said at a news roundtable.

U.S. officials have said in the past that Iran is fomenting instability in Iraq. In August, Army Brig. Gen. Michael Barbero said that the Iranian government is training many members of the Shiite insurgency in Iraq. Barbero is the deputy operations chief on the Joint Staff.

“Iran is definitely a destabilizing force in Iraq,” Barbero said during an Aug. 23 Pentagon news conference. “I think it's irrefutable that Iran is responsible for training, funding and equipping some of these Shiia extremist groups and also providing advanced (improvised explosive device) technology to them, and there's clear evidence of that.”

Zahner said Iran is funneling millions of dollars for military goods into Iraq. He noted that labels on C-4 explosive found in Baghdad make it clear where the munitions came from. “You'll find a red label on the C-4 printed in English and will tell you the lot number and name of the manufacturer,” he said.

In 2002, the Israelis seized a small ship bringing military supplies to Hezbollah. “Compare the labels on the military C-4 in that and tell me if they're not identical,” Zahner said.

He said British, Iraqi and American officials in Basra also have found blocks of C-4. “You will see the same red label for each and every one of those,” he said.

Zahner also said it’s clear that the Iranian government is behind the munitions shipments. “I will tell you that the control of military-grade explosives in Iran is controlled through the state apparatus and is not committed through rogue elements right there,” he said. “It is a deliberate decision on the part of elements associated with the Iranian government to affect this type of activities.”
How can liberals expect to deal with Iran diplomatically when they are doing this to us behind our backs??

[Angelicus]

RyzinEnagy wrote: http://www.defenselink.mil/news/NewsArticle.aspx?ID=1289

Quote: Iranian Government Behind Shipping Weapons to Iraq
By Jim Garamone
American Forces Press Service

WASHINGTON, Sept. 28, 2006 – The Iranian government is behind shipping components used to make improvised explosive devices to Iraqi insurgents, a senior intelligence official in Iraq said yesterday.

Labels on weapons stocks seized inside and outside Iraq point to Iranian government complicity in arming Shiite militias in Iraq, Army Maj. Gen. Richard Zahner, the deputy chief of staff for intelligence with Multinational Force Iraq, said at a news roundtable.

U.S. officials have said in the past that Iran is fomenting instability in Iraq. In August, Army Brig. Gen. Michael Barbero said that the Iranian government is training many members of the Shiite insurgency in Iraq. Barbero is the deputy operations chief on the Joint Staff.

“Iran is definitely a destabilizing force in Iraq,” Barbero said during an Aug. 23 Pentagon news conference. “I think it's irrefutable that Iran is responsible for training, funding and equipping some of these Shiia extremist groups and also providing advanced (improvised explosive device) technology to them, and there's clear evidence of that.”

Zahner said Iran is funneling millions of dollars for military goods into Iraq. He noted that labels on C-4 explosive found in Baghdad make it clear where the munitions came from. “You'll find a red label on the C-4 printed in English and will tell you the lot number and name of the manufacturer,” he said.

In 2002, the Israelis seized a small ship bringing military supplies to Hezbollah. “Compare the labels on the military C-4 in that and tell me if they're not identical,” Zahner said.

He said British, Iraqi and American officials in Basra also have found blocks of C-4. “You will see the same red label for each and every one of those,” he said.

Zahner also said it’s clear that the Iranian government is behind the munitions shipments. “I will tell you that the control of military-grade explosives in Iran is controlled through the state apparatus and is not committed through rogue elements right there,” he said. “It is a deliberate decision on the part of elements associated with the Iranian government to affect this type of activities.”
How can liberals expect to deal with Iran diplomatically when they are doing this to us behind our backs??

Ryzin you can't negotiate with someone if they are doing things like that.

IF the Iranian Government is behind that, and there is proof of this in the intelligence community beyond just this article, then we should quit playing games with the Mullahs and the President of Iran, Ajihadistinadinnerjacket and take Tehran out yesterday.

In fact if our government has proof of this, they should have snatched the Iranian President Ajihadistinadinnerjacket little boney ass up when he came to adress the U.N. a couple of weeks ago.

[Alizard]

Quote: Iran supplying Iraqi insurgents with weapons...

And the wahabbists in saudi Arabia supply them with the money to buy them.

So, what else is new.....

[Alizard]

Angelicus wrote: then we should quit playing games with the Mullahs and the President of Iran, Ajihadistinadinnerjacket and take Tehran out yesterday.



Sure, we'll use all the spare troops who we aren't using to fight the other two wars we are currently in.

Oh, wait......

[MoscowMatt]

Iran realises that whilst they supply the militants it will keep the West engaged in Iraq and divert some of the attention away from what they are up to. i.e the pursuit of Nuclear weapons!

[lilwolf]

Did you honestly expect anything else? These are the same so-called good guys that want to have nuclear energy.....right


Of course they been doing it. They are a nation that pure out and out operates on hate and not to much of anything else.

[Angelicus]

Alizard wrote: Angelicus wrote: then we should quit playing games with the Mullahs and the President of Iran, Ajihadistinadinnerjacket and take Tehran out yesterday.



Sure, we'll use all the spare troops who we aren't using to fight the other two wars we are currently in.

Oh, wait......

Alizard do the math.

1,000,000 minuse 170,000.

The United States has'nt done 1/10th of what it can do millitarily in either Iraq or Afghanistan.

IF the United States did, the appeasers and the BAF crowd would scream and whine and really be throwing the temper tantrums.

[Cal-Pak]

Why is it so hard to believe that Iran would supply weapons
to one side of a country that is in a civil war.
Particularly when that side is composed mostly of the same ethnic group as the people of Iran? i.e. Shiites

[Nico]

lilwolf wrote:

Of course they been doing it. They are a nation that pure out and out operates on hate and not to much of anything else.

Actually they're pretty damn ordinary and nice as people go. however it's hardly surprising that Iranian weapons are going just across the border. It's about as surprising as canada being invaded by a foreign country and then American weapons turning up later on in the hands of canadian 'insurgents'. i.e not at all.
One can hardly jump into a mud puddle then complain that it's full of mud. You go to Iran's sphere, you meet Iranian hardware. You also get to see old US cluster bombs doing the rounds as well. However those were brought to you by love not hate :P

[Nico]

Angelicus wrote: Alizard wrote: Angelicus wrote: then we should quit playing games with the Mullahs and the President of Iran, Ajihadistinadinnerjacket and take Tehran out yesterday.



Sure, we'll use all the spare troops who we aren't using to fight the other two wars we are currently in.

Oh, wait......

Alizard do the math.

1,000,000 minuse 170,000.

The United States has'nt done 1/10th of what it can do millitarily in either Iraq or Afghanistan.

IF the United States did, the appeasers and the BAF crowd would scream and whine and really be throwing the temper tantrums.


I'm sure it could do 10 times more, but not without a draft and societal mobilisation. When less than 1/2 the country agrees with your current path I would find it hard to see happening without some imminent national threat. damn democracy, tying your hands like that.
After watching the Iraq debacle I'm more convinced than ever that the US conventional military is the same beast it was in the 60's, with the same structural problems. I am also puzzled as to why there is the fascination with invading people and kicking ass from some quarters. My elders died to stop people from invading people. Are we saying it's now the done thing to project power by kicking in the doors of foreigners who look and act a little to our distaste? I'm genuinely dissapointed with what western power has become during 50 years; some kind of self-congratulatory, self-justifying dominance machine. It's basically a globally projected franchise for the purpose of keeping swarthy foreigners in line. And it's so x-box now, you can accidentally kill 100 people at a wedding, fly bombing missions on goverment issued methamphetamines and not feel a thing because it's not people, it's 'collateral'. Same story since I was a cricket, no change but the names of the countries. No surprises either, not given events like the USS Vincennes, what we did to Sukarno, Mossadeq, Allende et al.

Oh and here's a prediction: Iran won't be invaded in the near future.

[Angelicus]

Nico wrote: lilwolf wrote:

Of course they been doing it. They are a nation that pure out and out operates on hate and not to much of anything else.

Actually they're pretty damn ordinary and nice as people go. however it's hardly surprising that Iranian weapons are going just across the border. It's about as surprising as canada being invaded by a foreign country and then American weapons turning up later on in the hands of canadian 'insurgents'. i.e not at all.
One can hardly jump into a mud puddle then complain that it's full of mud. You go to Iran's sphere, you meet Iranian hardware. You also get to see old US cluster bombs doing the rounds as well. However those were brought to you by love not hate :P

The people maybe, however when speaking about the mullahs, and those who are in power within the Iranian Government they are anything but "pretty" or "damn ordinary", or "nice". In fact there is nothing thats "nice" about them.

[Angelicus]

Nico wrote: Angelicus wrote: Alizard wrote: Angelicus wrote: then we should quit playing games with the Mullahs and the President of Iran, Ajihadistinadinnerjacket and take Tehran out yesterday.



Sure, we'll use all the spare troops who we aren't using to fight the other two wars we are currently in.

Oh, wait......

Alizard do the math.

1,000,000 minuse 170,000.

The United States has'nt done 1/10th of what it can do millitarily in either Iraq or Afghanistan.

IF the United States did, the appeasers and the BAF crowd would scream and whine and really be throwing the temper tantrums.


I'm sure it could do 10 times more, but not without a draft and societal mobilisation. When less than 1/2 the country agrees with your current path I would find it hard to see happening without some imminent national threat. damn democracy, tying your hands like that.
After watching the Iraq debacle I'm more convinced than ever that the US conventional military is the same beast it was in the 60's, with the same structural problems. I am also puzzled as to why there is the fascination with invading people and kicking ass from some quarters. My elders died to stop people from invading people. Are we saying it's now the done thing to project power by kicking in the doors of foreigners who look and act a little to our distaste? I'm genuinely dissapointed with what western power has become during 50 years; some kind of self-congratulatory, self-justifying dominance machine. It's basically a globally projected franchise for the purpose of keeping swarthy foreigners in line. And it's so x-box now, you can accidentally kill 100 people at a wedding, fly bombing missions on goverment issued methamphetamines and not feel a thing because it's not people, it's 'collateral'. Same story since I was a cricket, no change but the names of the countries. No surprises either, not given events like the USS Vincennes, what we did to Sukarno, Mossadeq, Allende et al.

Oh and here's a prediction: Iran won't be invaded in the near future.

Anax you know what, in a way, you are exactly right.

See there is a structural problem, we have a problem because we continue too allow the extreme leftist anti-America, blame America first crowd have any say whatsoever in what our millitary can and cannot do.

We continue to allow those people to litterally put a leash on our millitary by allowing them to dictate that such things as "rules of engagement" that say our millitary cannot go after someone thats shooting at them, because that person happens to be hiding in a mosque.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6542346/site/newsweek/

[Mighty Oak]

Ah,the brainwashing continues.

[Byrne]

Angelicus wrote: Nico wrote: Angelicus wrote: Alizard wrote: Angelicus wrote: then we should quit playing games with the Mullahs and the President of Iran, Ajihadistinadinnerjacket and take Tehran out yesterday.



Sure, we'll use all the spare troops who we aren't using to fight the other two wars we are currently in.

Oh, wait......

Alizard do the math.

1,000,000 minuse 170,000.

The United States has'nt done 1/10th of what it can do millitarily in either Iraq or Afghanistan.

IF the United States did, the appeasers and the BAF crowd would scream and whine and really be throwing the temper tantrums.


I'm sure it could do 10 times more, but not without a draft and societal mobilisation. When less than 1/2 the country agrees with your current path I would find it hard to see happening without some imminent national threat. damn democracy, tying your hands like that.
After watching the Iraq debacle I'm more convinced than ever that the US conventional military is the same beast it was in the 60's, with the same structural problems. I am also puzzled as to why there is the fascination with invading people and kicking ass from some quarters. My elders died to stop people from invading people. Are we saying it's now the done thing to project power by kicking in the doors of foreigners who look and act a little to our distaste? I'm genuinely dissapointed with what western power has become during 50 years; some kind of self-congratulatory, self-justifying dominance machine. It's basically a globally projected franchise for the purpose of keeping swarthy foreigners in line. And it's so x-box now, you can accidentally kill 100 people at a wedding, fly bombing missions on goverment issued methamphetamines and not feel a thing because it's not people, it's 'collateral'. Same story since I was a cricket, no change but the names of the countries. No surprises either, not given events like the USS Vincennes, what we did to Sukarno, Mossadeq, Allende et al.

Oh and here's a prediction: Iran won't be invaded in the near future.

Anax you know what, in a way, you are exactly right.

See there is a structural problem, we have a problem because we continue too allow the extreme leftist anti-America, blame America first crowd have any say whatsoever in what our millitary can and cannot do.

We continue to allow those people to litterally put a leash on our millitary by allowing them to dictate that such things as "rules of engagement" that say our millitary cannot go after someone thats shooting at them, because that person happens to be hiding in a mosque.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6542346/site/newsweek/

We're getting pretty wordy here aren't we? Wouldn't it be much simpler to say America ought to be able to commit Genocide.

I've been hearing that we should do the old kill them all and let God sort them out. It's for their own good right.

When Bush said we would be greeted as liberators what he meant was that we would be liberating everyone from their life.

[lilwolf]

Nico wrote: lilwolf wrote:

Of course they been doing it. They are a nation that pure out and out operates on hate and not to much of anything else.

Actually they're pretty damn ordinary and nice as people go. however it's hardly surprising that Iranian weapons are going just across the border. It's about as surprising as canada being invaded by a foreign country and then American weapons turning up later on in the hands of canadian 'insurgents'. i.e not at all.
One can hardly jump into a mud puddle then complain that it's full of mud. You go to Iran's sphere, you meet Iranian hardware. You also get to see old US cluster bombs doing the rounds as well. However those were brought to you by love not hate :P

I will rephrase that, the leaders and mullahs are the dangerous ones in that they operate on hate and not much else, and they encourage others to continue on with it.
Hell can hardly name a nation that has not sold weapons in the last century to Iran or Iraq. Cluster bombs work pretty well if used right and they have improved them a great deal. While I do not like them they are efficient in what they are designed to do. But no all weapons are 100% efficient, so spare me the lecture on their explosionn rates...thank you.

[eynon]

Nico wrote: Angelicus wrote: Alizard wrote: Angelicus wrote: then we should quit playing games with the Mullahs and the President of Iran, Ajihadistinadinnerjacket and take Tehran out yesterday.



Sure, we'll use all the spare troops who we aren't using to fight the other two wars we are currently in.

Oh, wait......

Alizard do the math.

1,000,000 minuse 170,000.

The United States has'nt done 1/10th of what it can do millitarily in either Iraq or Afghanistan.

IF the United States did, the appeasers and the BAF crowd would scream and whine and really be throwing the temper tantrums.


I'm sure it could do 10 times more, but not without a draft and societal mobilisation. When less than 1/2 the country agrees with your current path I would find it hard to see happening without some imminent national threat. damn democracy, tying your hands like that.
After watching the Iraq debacle I'm more convinced than ever that the US conventional military is the same beast it was in the 60's, with the same structural problems. I am also puzzled as to why there is the fascination with invading people and kicking ass from some quarters. My elders died to stop people from invading people. Are we saying it's now the done thing to project power by kicking in the doors of foreigners who look and act a little to our distaste? I'm genuinely dissapointed with what western power has become during 50 years; some kind of self-congratulatory, self-justifying dominance machine. It's basically a globally projected franchise for the purpose of keeping swarthy foreigners in line. And it's so x-box now, you can accidentally kill 100 people at a wedding, fly bombing missions on goverment issued methamphetamines and not feel a thing because it's not people, it's 'collateral'. Same story since I was a cricket, no change but the names of the countries. No surprises either, not given events like the USS Vincennes, what we did to Sukarno, Mossadeq, Allende et al.

Oh and here's a prediction: Iran won't be invaded in the near future.

nice way of summing things up :)

personally after WW2 I think we should've stuck to the theories of good old Mahan: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alfred_Thayer_Mahan

as to the same structural problems facing the US in the 60s and today I believe you're right, that problem was and is the Sec of Defense.......

[ffum]

It seems only Nico gets it.
War is good Business, We (the power brokers) set this ball rolling a very long time ago, i.e who put Sadam in power and fed him, who toppled the secular rulers of Iran, placing a, yes man, in power ( the shah), setting of this wave off religious control that lasts untill today.( And buy the way ,all the Persians I've met have been the most kind people ). I'm not judging every American buy the ideals Ann Coulter holds ,so why judge all in Iran by what agenda driven news reports say,or the ideals of the religious hardline.
Its all about power ,and political and global position, and we are pushing to stay at the front of this line. I guess you could call it Empire maintenance.
One other thing ,why do so many of you put a price on a life, is an American life worth so much more than any other persons life?.

[Kane]

If we really have 1 million troops and we're only deploying 160,000 in Iraq...

and allocating units exiting from Afghanistan to Iraq as NATO takes over there...

and our troops are serving extended periods of service for no apparent good reason...

and we're calling up National Guard reserves...

then I'm stumped as to why nobody's calling this administration out. :-|

[98MustGT]

lilwolf wrote: Did you honestly expect anything else? These are the same so-called good guys that want to have nuclear energy.....right


Of course they been doing it. They are a nation that pure out and out operates on hate and not to much of anything else.

Well they don't have much oil, why deny them nuclear energy?

[eynon]

Kane wrote: If we really have 1 million troops and we're only deploying 160,000 in Iraq...

and allocating units exiting from Afghanistan to Iraq as NATO takes over there...

and our troops are serving extended periods of service for no apparent good reason...

and we're calling up National Guard reserves...

then I'm stumped as to why nobody's calling this administration out. :-|


for one thing the Guard is more expendible then front line troops.......but yeah, you make some good points.......