Political Crossfire Forums

[stringsshraugh]

what lands did they try to steal in the 18th and 19th century?
these irish people that work with the british and considered ireland part of britain were getting well paid to think so.
the potatoes failed,but that was all,the rest of the vegatables were ok,shipped off to india and any other place the british were occupying at that time.
the prod landlords were put in by the british to control the land and basically take it for the british.
why else would you think they were there?
was it to teach the irish how to farm?
come on now.
the famine relief was token.
food that could not be eaten,the dogs got better.
my family were badly affected by this.
a lot of them died from disease caused by unhygenic food and conditions.
the brits were creaming the country dry.
famine relief was a propoganda machine for the world
i wont go back to 1066.
but 1174 was when the first english king came over to ireland.
they never left yet.
i wonder when we will ever have the whole of this country country free of british rule.
you mention a few massacres that happened in england in the past.
in ireland it was a murder machine to get rid of the irish.800 yrs of it.
i think it still annoys the powers to be in england and a lot of the people
a superpower,one of the g8 who could take on any country in the world with their military might/
and in ireland a handfull of farmers sons and daughters were able to get them to the negotiating table.
life is funny.
gerry adams for president.

[stringsshraugh]

see
www.kinsella.org.

[gaucho]

Falklands were stolen in 1833... british should read and study more hitory. Besides, british children dont know where falklands are...

[thundertaker]

Stolen? The English laid claim to them as far back as 1690, before they were seized by the French in 1764 and then hawked off to the Spaniards in 1767. On that basis, the Argentinians laid claim to the Islands......

But enough about the colonial history of the islands, all sides concerned were nakedly imperialstic concerning who owned the islands, and Britain happened to win the argument.

The vast majority of islanders wished to remain British. Besides, why on earth would they have wanted to have been taken over by a despotic military junta back in 1982?

[jalvarez]

As I am an Argentinean, I always listened only one bell, a local one...
And the same could be applied to you guys, English or North Americans. (I'm trying to avoid the use of "Yankees" -many US citizens don't like it- or "Americans", as all Latin Americans are Americans too)
I have very good friends in both US and England, and due to this I think that my opinion is a balanced one. There are good and bad people in all countries, including obviously mine. What is the real problem here and there is the ambition of richness, and ultimately, the ambition for power.
What motivates the politics nowadays? Power (let’s define power as the capacity of deciding something against the opinion of others). Power is a drug for some leaders. Galtieri (de facto president of Argentina when we invaded Malvinas (or Falklands) was a drunk man, blind due to his power, that apparently was informed or convinced by some crazy diplomatic that the US wont participate if the islands were occupied.
The war we lost help us to eliminate the militaries in the government of our country, but doesn’t help us in eliminating corruption and inefficiencies. So we are still trying to go out of this mess. And I’m not personally an optimistic in our future.
Bush and Blair are at present drunk of power. But you guys are not the “sheriffs of the world”. And this was demonstrated both in Vietnam and now in Iraq. As Ho Chi Min said “It’s impossible to defeat whom has nothing to loose”.
Friends, your country and your folks are beginning to be intensively hated, more and more each day, and this is due to all the recent wars you were involved: starting with Vietnam, the invasion of Grenade, Iraq by two (Oil Wars), Pakistan, Yugoslavia and Milosevic, just to mention some of them I remember now. But you, in the “sheriffs of the world” role, forgot the 20 years civil war in Sudan – Africa, where 2 million people were killed. Oh, no, Iraq was more important! Come on, people… who ignores that you are trying to remain with your incredible comfort (5% of the world is consuming one third of the oil!!!) and sign the Kioto protocol, please…
Finishing with the Falklands / Malvinas. Maybe you have some rights (and at least all the power, or the weapons) but this is something that needs to be discussed in the UN or in The Hague and not here. Do it, you never discussed the issue.
And think that your countries will leave Gibraltar and Ireland and Malvinas and Guantanamo some day… The Empires always have an end, and the US and England wont be an exception. Maybe the US and England gain some respect if they do it gently and in time, trying to favor all people, not only US and England proud and interests.
Just my thoughts…

[thundertaker]

Britain nowadays only maintains a prescence when the local people want us there, the vast majority of locals in Gibralter, the Falklands and Northern Ireland wish to remain British, and until this changes, Britain will have to stay there......

[stringsshraugh]

the local people you refer to thundertaker,
are generally,decendants of british people whom were planted or stationed in these countries in the past.
of course they want to stay british,but what about the indigenous people of these robbed lands.
theres loads of people in my country want to stay british.
they want to run the country as well,
its not on though.
the argentinians and irish and any other countries occupied by the british should be set free, and the planters taken home.
whats the advantage of being british?

[thundertaker]

Suggesting that people who have been born there and whose families have been there for hundreds of years makes about as much sense as calling for the return of all White americans to the European countries from whence their ancestors came. Are you in the Zanu-PF or something?
In the case of Northern Ireland, the scottish 'planters' in Ulster were only 'returning home' anyway. As the Scots were a tribe from Northern Ireland who invaded Pictland in the 5th and 6th centuries before gradually taking over the country and calling it 'Scotland'........:twisted:

[stringsshraugh]

what about the catholic/nationalist people that happen to be there as well.
are you saying these are invaders.
the best thing britain could do is,get out of the world if that were possible.
and i think that would make the world a better place.

[thundertaker]

The Catholics in NI are no different ethnically from the Protestants, they're both Scotch-Irish...........

[jalvarez]

Interesting.
A moderator team composed only by US citizens. :lol:
The only reality is that the UK took over the islands. Right or not. What can we do now? Just what we are doing. Protest.
Our land was invaded by british twice, in 1806 and 1807, the last time with 13000 soldiers. Both times we won. Now, we fail in recovering our islands. Bad adventure, like yours.
No war is fruitful, including this one.
Irak will be a second Vietnam. This is a good topic, not the -now- old Falklands/Malvinas war
No comment about being the "energy consumers" U are?

[thundertaker]

You can protest all you want, until the majority of people there want to become Argentinian citizens, they will remain British. Whatever the rights and wrongs of the past, that is the situation we are in now and it is only fair to protect the democratic right of the islanders to remain British...........

[stringsshraugh]

been away for a while.
anyway thunderman you say the rights or wrongs of the past.this is justifying what the brit did.take the world by hook or crook murder etc.
so now its ok for all the decendants of these brits to be left alone in the various colonies.dont hurt them.dont send them home.
they need protection
pity the natives never had any protection when the raiders were invading.
i can never understand the brit intellect.they will always try to justify what was done in the past.
never admit to the sins against all the parts of the world they wanted to occupy.
but then again they are the perfect people.everything in england is right.and the rest of the world drives on the wrong side.
pity the british nation never wised up.

[thundertaker]

Quote: anyway thunderman you say the rights or wrongs of the past.this is justifying what the brit did.take the world by hook or crook murder etc.
so now its ok for all the decendants of these brits to be left alone in the various colonies.dont hurt them.dont send them home.
they need protection

So, you suggest that to make amends for things that happened long before living memory, British descendents should be ethnically-cleansed from wherever their ancestors settled, and send them back to the land of their origin?


Human history is a story of invasions and re-settlements.
Argenetinians are descended from Spanish settlers, does that mean they should pack their bags and 'return' to spain?

[stringsshraugh]

my concern would be more with the north of ireland not argentina and the orange[not protestant] occupiers whom want to run the land for their own benefit leaving the irish catholic people with nothing where possible.
i would very much like if england who planted these peoples descendants there to now take them out of it unless they agree to live equally with the original irish people from there.
you i am sure read the papers and will see what i mean.
paisley and his cronies.
you can have them back.
they are actually more loyal to the crown than the average englishman,but they make life difficult for the irish people.

[thundertaker]

stringsshraugh wrote: my concern would be more with the north of ireland not argentina and the orange[not protestant] occupiers whom want to run the land for their own benefit leaving the irish catholic people with nothing where possible.
i would very much like if england who planted these peoples descendants there to now take them out of it unless they agree to live equally with the original irish people from there.
you i am sure read the papers and will see what i mean.
paisley and his cronies.
you can have them back.
they are actually more loyal to the crown than the average englishman,but they make life difficult for the irish people.

Most of those planters were scottish, not english. Besides, it's no use whining about things that happened hundreds of years ago, NI is the home to protestants as much as it is the catholics and they want to remain part of the UK. There's no way around that until the majority of the residents of NI want to re-unify with the rest of Ireland.....