Political Crossfire Forums

[Muslima]

ALSALAM ALIKUM

well even though it is the islam section i would like to ask all non-muslims
a question

muslims you can argue but please don't try to answer

okay the question:

"WHY DO YOU ALL NON MUSLIMS HATE ISLAM? WHAT CAUSED YOU TO START HATING IT?"

please be honest as possible BUT answer in manners

[prometeus]

That is a very broad statement and it is inaccurate. Hate is not the right description for those that feel an animus toward Islam or Muslims, and not all non-muslims share that feeling.
However, it is not a surprise to see those feelings in light of the multitude of manifestations that dominated and dominate the news for a very long time now. The suicide bombing, hateful propaganda, hate speeches from leaders of Islamic nations, Al-Qaida, the list seems endless. Couple that with the practices, policies of governments in Islamic countries, and with a religion that has no central leadership, a religion whose texts when read by an outsider comes across as violent, non-tolerant, contradictory, a religion whose founder appears unholy, then it is not surprising that little sympathy is directed towards Muslims.

[Muslima]

well i see that the reasons you stated are lame reasons to "a synonym for hate" muslims

[Blinky]

I don't hate muslims but I often wonder if they feel the same about me. I know for a fact that many of them judge me because of the way I live my life and that pisses me off.
Its a common trait among religious people. Religion should be, in my opinion, a personal choice. Religious people, if they truely believe that they are right, should be content in the knowledge that they are abiding by the contract set between themselves and god, and they shouldn't worry about what everyone else is doing with their lives.

Muslima, you should not be so quick to judge prometeus. Some valid points were made:
Quote: suicide bombing, hateful propaganda, hate speeches from leaders of Islamic nations, Al-Qaida, the list seems endless. Couple that with the practices, policies of governments in Islamic countries, and with a religion that has no central leadership, a religion whose texts when read by an outsider comes across as violent, non-tolerant, contradictory, a religion whose founder appears unholy
Its a fact that these things occur. How would you expect others to feel about such atrocities? If these things are being carried out in the name of a religion , then that religion's image is most definately going to be adversely affected.
Now, I know that you will probably claim that the actions of some people cannot be taken to be representative of the whole of Islam. And you're right, BUT they are one side of Islam nevertheless, and it is human nature to fear such things.
There are a billion muslims in the world. Surely, sooner or later the majority of these one billion people will denounce and actively seek to stamp out the face of Islam that is the source of their negative reputation. From an outsider's perspective, the problem so far has been that clearly not enough muslims have stood up and said that they're not going to put up with these peole ruining Islam's image. If a member of your family acts innappropriately, you take them aside and tell them not to do whatever they did again.
In my view, this hasn't happened, or if it has, it hasn't worked.

[binderdonedat]

prometeus wrote: That is a very broad statement and it is inaccurate. Hate is not the right description for those that feel an animus toward Islam or Muslims, and not all non-muslims share that feeling.
However, it is not a surprise to see those feelings in light of the multitude of manifestations that dominated and dominate the news for a very long time now. The suicide bombing, hateful propaganda, hate speeches from leaders of Islamic nations, Al-Qaida, the list seems endless. Couple that with the practices, policies of governments in Islamic countries, and with a religion that has no central leadership, a religion whose texts when read by an outsider comes across as violent, non-tolerant, contradictory, a religion whose founder appears unholy, then it is not surprising that little sympathy is directed towards Muslims.


I see that is your first post. Great points, i totally agree.

Oh, and welcome!

[Muslima]

nice reply Blinky

i do agree with you
but many of the non-muslims, especailly westerners, who live in the middle east do hate us muslims even though they are not being harmed or anything and are living lives they might not dream of their own countries.....

when we muslims travel to the us or european countries we should be checked thoroughly
our luggages are opened , women must remove their covers, some even make muslims remove thier shoes

i think that everybody knows that we muslims don't approve dogs, so why did an australian officer make a dog sniff my cousin? isn't it a way to show hatred and that all muslims are bad or whatever?

we do have some hatred, mainly because of the way they view us, for non muslims but we don't treat the way non muslims do......

[prometeus]

Muslima,

I regret that you perceived my reply as just lame synonyms for hate. I assure you they were not meant to be that. Before I posted that reply, I took time to read several of the threads in this section of the board. I felt that you asked a sincere question and I offered a sincere answer. I also came to think after reading your posts that you were a fair and open minded person, not one to dismiss a reply just because it was not to your liking. You asked the question remember?

Should you wish to further discuss these issues, I will be more than happy to elaborate. I think that even if we can not agree on some or any of them, as long as we remain sincere and respectful of each-other, we can benefit from an open discussion.

Thank you for the welcome binderdonedat.

[Blinky]

Muslima wrote: nice reply Blinky

i do agree with you
but many of the non-muslims, especailly westerners, who live in the middle east do hate us muslims even though they are not being harmed or anything and are living lives they might not dream of their own countries.....

when we muslims travel to the us or european countries we should be checked thoroughly
our luggages are opened , women must remove their covers, some even make muslims remove thier shoes

i think that everybody knows that we muslims don't approve dogs, so why did an australian officer make a dog sniff my cousin? isn't it a way to show hatred and that all muslims are bad or whatever?

we do have some hatred, mainly because of the way they view us, for non muslims but we don't treat the way non muslims do......


Muslima, in Australia (and most places in the world) sniffer dogs are used at airports as a security measure. All people are subject to it. I for one didn't know muslims had a problem with dogs. I could say that my religion forbids me to pass my luggage through x-ray machines at the airport if I wanted and then take whatever I want onto a plane.
If you don't like how airports are run in Australia or anywhere, you don't have to go there. You cannot expect exemption from established security checks because of your religion - because that breaches our rights to search people coming into our country as we see fit. If New Zealand had a policy of making people swim naked through a pool filled with baked beans, I'd probably just not go there if I wasn't prepared to do that.
One argument you could make is that muslims are targetted more often than non-muslims for "random" screening by dogs etc. You would probably be right, but there is a reason for that. I think you know what that is.

[Robin Hood]

Quote: i think that everybody knows that we muslims don't approve dogs,

There's nothing in your religion anywhere that should lead you to that position.

[merry_christian]

Islam is a religion of hate, and so I hate hate.

For one thing they mistreat their women. Tell me, how is your wife supposed to cook dinner in one of those burka things. You know she's gotta get hot in there what with all those frying pans and ovens and whatnot.

Secondly, the obvious, 911. You hit us, we're gonna hit back twice as hard. At least we have the technology to only kill the bad guys and leave the decent people alone, even if they are just some Muslims..

Next, you have your Islamic governments. It's not fair that you guys get to have Islamic government, but for some reason, Christian nations have to be secular. I can assure you, if the United States was truly Christian, it'd be a lot worse for you guys, a lot worse.

Maybe I can think of some more later, but for now, I'll just leave it at that.

[F'losrix]

Muslima wrote: ALSALAM ALIKUM

well even though it is the islam section i would like to ask all non-muslims
a question

muslims you can argue but please don't try to answer

okay the question:

"WHY DO YOU ALL NON MUSLIMS HATE ISLAM? WHAT CAUSED YOU TO START HATING IT?"

please be honest as possible BUT answer in manners

Why do you assume that all non-muslims hate Islam?

What I hate is the notion that anyone who expresses concern over the ambitions of the extremists within any faith must be accused of hating all practitioners of that faith.

Islam is fine as long as its adherents don't demand that I share their faith or live by their religious laws. I live in a diverse community that includes people of many nationalities and differing faiths. It's only the people who can't mind their own business that create a problem for everyone else.

[Muslima]

prometeus wrote: Muslima,

I regret that you perceived my reply as just lame synonyms for hate. I assure you they were not meant to be that. Before I posted that reply, I took time to read several of the threads in this section of the board. I felt that you asked a sincere question and I offered a sincere answer. I also came to think after reading your posts that you were a fair and open minded person, not one to dismiss a reply just because it was not to your liking. You asked the question remember?

Should you wish to further discuss these issues, I will be more than happy to elaborate. I think that even if we can not agree on some or any of them, as long as we remain sincere and respectful of each-other, we can benefit from an open discussion.

Thank you for the welcome binderdonedat.

i am sorry that i misunderstood you its just that your sentences gave me other definitions, and yes why not argue in a mannered way but in a different thread?

[Muslima]

blinky, i haven't been to australlia......i know why muslims are more targetted than others but i think it is not fair!

we don't lie about our religion and i am not expecting anything from strangers and i won't do something i dont want to do

the thing that is bothering me is that people tend to judge easily on muslims, except for the terrorism things we muslims are people who relate things to religion...this is who we are and i don't know why people dislike it, its not as if we are doing this to make them convert or anything.....

i just want everybody to know that muslims are normal people.......


robin hood there is!

[Muslima]

merry_christian wrote: Islam is a religion of hate, and so I hate hate.

For one thing they mistreat their women. Tell me, how is your wife supposed to cook dinner in one of those burka things. You know she's gotta get hot in there what with all those frying pans and ovens and whatnot.

Secondly, the obvious, 911. You hit us, we're gonna hit back twice as hard. At least we have the technology to only kill the bad guys and leave the decent people alone, even if they are just some Muslims..

Next, you have your Islamic governments. It's not fair that you guys get to have Islamic government, but for some reason, Christian nations have to be secular. I can assure you, if the United States was truly Christian, it'd be a lot worse for you guys, a lot worse.

Maybe I can think of some more later, but for now, I'll just leave it at that.

well if you want to hate it hate it i am not losing anything

as for the women you really made me laugh because burqas and shailas are only worn out of the house in front of non blood relating men.....no women would wear burqa while cooking it will burn!

well the us has done alot worse to muslims than what 9-11 has done if don't see chanels other than cnn and bbc

why do you think it is not fair?
we want an islamic goverment and you want a secular?
isn't this freedom of choice?
well if you want your country to be christain speak up

by the way i am not scared from your " a lot worse"

[Muslima]

Skeptical Mystic wrote: Muslima wrote: ALSALAM ALIKUM

well even though it is the islam section i would like to ask all non-muslims
a question

muslims you can argue but please don't try to answer

okay the question:

"WHY DO YOU ALL NON MUSLIMS HATE ISLAM? WHAT CAUSED YOU TO START HATING IT?"

please be honest as possible BUT answer in manners

Why do you assume that all non-muslims hate Islam?

What I hate is the notion that anyone who expresses concern over the ambitions of the extremists within any faith must be accused of hating all practitioners of that faith.

Islam is fine as long as its adherents don't demand that I share their faith or live by their religious laws. I live in a diverse community that includes people of many nationalities and differing faiths. It's only the people who can't mind their own business that create a problem for everyone else.

well look at what is happening in the world and see that many hate muslims

i think you are right , everybody should mind thier busnisses and nobody will force you to convert if you don't want to.....but if you decided or something made go and live in an islamic country.....shouldn't you at least respect the beliefs and things....drinking and gambling you could do in specific places besides other things but lets say
you are living in an islamic country with a girlfriend or wife and you were out for dinner or something and wanted to makeout, would you do it considering that making out in public is disrespectful and immoral in islamic countries?

[Robin Hood]

Quote: robin hood there is!

Where?

[Muslima]

dogs are considered filthy in islam
there are many sayings of the prophet
they only are good for wayching over something

[Robin Hood]

Muslima wrote: dogs are considered filthy in islam
there are many sayings of the prophet
they only are good for wayching over something

I asked for evidence or proof?

[F'losrix]

Muslima wrote: well look at what is happening in the world and see that many hate muslims
Many is neither all nor most.

Muslima wrote: i think you are right , everybody should mind thier busnisses and nobody will force you to convert if you don't want to.....but if you decided or something made go and live in an islamic country.....shouldn't you at least respect the beliefs and things....drinking and gambling you could do in specific places besides other things but lets say
you are living in an islamic country with a girlfriend or wife and you were out for dinner or something and wanted to makeout, would you do it considering that making out in public is disrespectful and immoral in islamic countries?
Your question would seem to indicate that you have a somewhat skewed view of how people in non-Islamic countries live. The great majority of us do act with discretion and don't necessarily appreciate seeing others 'make out' in public.

But to the central point of your question: I believe that people need to be respectful of the cultural norms wherever they happen to travel. That includes Muslims who have migrated to countries where they comprise a minority and where the culture is much more open about things like sexuality. I'm not saying you have to engage in behavior that goes against your religion's doctrines, but you shoud be prepared to accept that the dominant culture isn't going to change overnight to adopt Islamic principles. By way of example, the Netherlands are generally viewed as having a very socially liberal culture, but a rise in violence there perpetrated by hard line practitioners of Islam who haven't adapted to the difference in cultural norms is making the Dutch rethink their openness to immigration. They value their culture's diversity, and some there are coming to view the demands of Muslims for social reforms supporting their religious views as a serious threat.

[Demonic Spoon]

Quote:
"WHY DO YOU ALL NON MUSLIMS HATE ISLAM? WHAT CAUSED YOU TO START HATING IT?"


Wow, that's just pathetic. Saying that all non-muslims hate Islam is as bad as saying all muslims are terrorists.

I dislike Islam just as much as I dislike any other religion, and for the same reasons-it draws people to irrational actions, and it in and of itself is irrational.