Political Crossfire Forums

[Rankor and Pissing]

The more I read the outrageous conspiracy theories, from 9/11 to catching Osama was not really the goal, but keeping Americans in a perpetual state of fear was the goal of Bush, the more becomes evident. From Kentucky Fried Chicken making black men impotent to the Apollo 11 Moon Landings were faked in a Hollywood sound stage, what's clear is that people are very, very bored.

The boredom comes from people finally realizing that they won't be someone very important. That they'll simply be another person who will work, have a family, live and die and then 2 generations later, no one will ever remember they were alive at all. So, my opinion here is, why not make things a little interesting and make things sound better than they really are? With this method, they can be part of something much bigger than themselves - they are part of a conspiracy - sounds sexy no? They also have WAY too much time on their hands to either:
a.) think up this stuff
b.) waste their time reading it
c.) continue to waste their time by REPEATING it and then
d.) trying to convince other that this waste of their life actually means anything.

There's a much more sinister portion of this, especially when it involves the hated Bush Co. Spreading dissent, outright lies and fabrications to achieve a set goal - to confuse, to obfuscate and misguide normal thinking people, into bobble headed believers. This goes to the axiom of 'If you're told enough times that white is black, you'll eventually believe white is black". So dissent is part of it, certainly to misguide and causing diversions around the actual issue, then of course is the repetition and constant blathering of kook mantra. Ask for a fact? More broken logic. Demand evidence? More mantra. Ask poignant questions? You get responses like "Good question!" and "Many people are now asking that too!" and the result is, you get another nasty spoonful of mantra. Never a scanned memo, never an email, never a piece of physical evidence. Hell, not even a faked piece of evidence. (Apparently they are too lazy to use Photoshop). Evidence is never forthcoming, therefore, YOU (the unfortunate soul who's been conned into responding coherently) are now at a total disadvantage; since no physical evidence will ever be forthcoming, you must debate and demand on the conspiracy territory of "more kook mantra". Very much like discussing Quantum Physics with a 2 year old. As well, when you finally realize you've been conned into discussing this with the conspiracy handicapped, ultimately you'll be told you cannot prove this (the kookiness) is false and that ANYONE with 2 brain cells can see it's absolutely 100% genuine absolute from "Gods mouth to your ears" truth, on the life of their kids - honest... really... no, no ... REALLY.

Some believers I'm convinced are actually mentally unsound, so they are relatively harmless. The one's that have convinced themselves that the unreal is real, have the undying urge to convince everyone else they are simply un-educated and misguided fools for thinking what you think. Evidence isn't needed they'll say, "it's so obvious! You still believe the ____________ ___________ pablum the government feeds you!" The ultimate goal is to convert the unconverted.

The logical mantra is the key; it must put together linkages that sound possible and at least plausible, yet the logic is usually very strange. For example:

Regarding JFK and Lincoln

Abraham Lincoln was elected to Congress in 1846.
John F. Kennedy was elected to Congress in 1946.

Abraham Lincoln was elected President in 1860.
John F. Kennedy was elected President in 1960.

The names Lincoln and Kennedy each contain seven letters.

Lincoln's secretary, Kennedy, warned him not to go to the theatre.
Kennedy's secretary, Lincoln, warned him not to go to Dallas.

Andrew Johnson, who succeeded Lincoln, was born in 1808.
Lyndon Johnson, who succeeded Kennedy, was born in 1908.

John Wilkes Booth was born in 1839.
Lee Harvey Oswald was born in 1939.

Both names are comprised of fifteen letters


Common sense says this is nothing more than coincidence and that if someone looks hard enough, many coincidences can be found in every day life which mean absolutely nothing. Other methods are the famous folding of the 20 dollar bill which shows the 9/11 WTC terrorist activities - which again, means nothing.

Example:

September 11th was orchestrated by the U.S. Government
- Evidence? Nil
- Physical proof? Nil
- Mantra? Tons of innuendo, coupled with pictures, links to Bush, the "7 minutes", the lack of clear pictures of the "missile" that hit the Pentagon in a newly reinforced section, the pre-placed explosives in the WTC towers, the confiscated video by the FBI from a gas station, etc...

Problem: Not one shred of evidence supports any of this.
Solution: Keep repeating the same fiction until someone believes it
Success rate: Pretty good - those who hate the current government, "Bush Co." foreign policy and a lot of Europeans are big believers.

So let's review...

Goals:

1. Dissent against authority (appeals to the young and impressionable)
2. Diversion to the actual happenings
3. Misdirection of the actual issues or events
4. A break from boredom and their apparent "common" lives to be part of something "Big"
5. Conversion of the fools who still think differently
6. Overwhelming need to convince others


Conclusion: Run away, run fast, do not stop and collect your $200. Only enter into it if you do not mind debating fictional occurrences, in a setting of theory, using "what if" scenario's, and don't mind deliberating in logical circles of insanity. I haven't got ONE SHRED of evidence that any of this is true... wanna debate? :lol:


Reference:
Top 10 Conspiracy Theories
Top 10 Middle East Conspiracies

[NAB]

I like it when that nail gets hit squarely and surely

:tu:

[Rankor and Pissing]

Been chewing on this for a little while...

[Revenant]

The topic creator is working for the CIA.

He's out to get us.

[Wizard From Oz]

There is one possible reason you left out

5th Columnists

[Revenant]

Most are fake, however the one concerning the Brotherhood is real.

The US government planning 9/11 is fake, and so is the "official" story, read more about NOD in the other topic.

[johnflesh]

It would take pure evidence IN a trial against 'the accused' for me to totally agree with these conspiracies one and all. It is funny though how, when all put together, they are connected, but that could be as easy as making up s**t as I go. This connection is the only reason they 'interest' me. (I punched that word on purpose, heh). These theories are like a book, a neat story, full of drama and needlessly complicated schemes that the elites go through in order to procure a subtle form of slavery. But in thinking this, I am not one to refute them either, that isn't my business, just as it isn't to support them. Interesting, is all..

Now, perhaps IF this post 911 nation we live in were; to become more vunerable to the powers of Bush's (or any president) administration , based on the fear of world wide attacks, terror, etc.., and said administration were to capitolize on this advantage, I'd not put it past them one second. That isn't conspiracy, that is politics. So I think perhaps if there is any fear mongering, it would have been because of the conspiracy theories themselves, and not that the conspiracy of 'an agenda' were true.

Hope you follow...

EDIT: Forgot to mention, coincidence...something COMPLETELY offtopic but you said "Common sense says this is nothing more than coincidence and that if someone looks hard enough, many coincidences can be found in every day life which mean absolutely nothing."

Coincidence is not nothing. There is a lot more to coincidence than meets the eye. Coincidence happens when something is there, you cannot see. I am not sure how you feel about spiritualism, (off topic here) but there is a very interesting book that discusses coincidence in specifics. The Author; James Redfield - The Celestine Prophecy. Perhaps you've heard of it, like anything.. has its hardcore followers, moderate readers (me), and critics, but is an interesting take on coincidence..and what it means.

It states that when a coincidence happens we should take a moment to realize that it happened and what it meant. As you do this you will 'notice' more coincidences happen in everyday life. As you strengthen this part of your awarness, everything becomes a coincidence, (so-to-speak) and life becomes more tangible and predictable than ever.

Most noted coincidence I've had that stood out, and more than once.

Being in another city than my home, seeing someone that reminded me of someone I hadn't seen since highschool 12 years ago. Within the hour, I actually run into that person. This has happened twice in Atlanta and when I visited Yellowstone NP. To say that I thought of a person before I ran into them, after 12 years of not thinking about them, as nothing, is not correct. IMHO.

Now I am super sorry about this, just had to get this off my chest too, lol. I do not mean to highjack this very informative thread.

[cap'n queasy]

I'll just say this.

Conspiracy theories put Hitler into power.

Something to think about.

[Archy]

Conspiracy theories turn me on...

[Revenant]

Archy wrote: Conspiracy theories turn me on...

......awkward

[Rankor and Pissing]

Revenant wrote: Archy wrote: Conspiracy theories turn me on...

......awkward

... and a little creepy... but Conspiracy stuff sure is interesting fiction reading. They are a creative bunch I'll give them that.


I'm wondering though... why the usual conspiracy junkies aren't here telling me my conspiracy is bulls**t.

Hmm..... :think:

[NAB]

Rankor and Pissing wrote: Revenant wrote: Archy wrote: Conspiracy theories turn me on...

......awkward

... and a little creepy... but Conspiracy stuff sure is interesting fiction reading. They are a creative bunch I'll give them that.


I'm wondering though... why the usual conspiracy junkies aren't here telling me my conspiracy is bulls**t.

Hmm..... :think:

Obviously because you are a slave and therefore beneath their contempt. :wink:

[Norrin Radd]

What conspiracies have you researched?

I have spent 200 hours researching TWA 800 and it is an obvious coverup.

I spent well over 100 hours researching the OKC bombing and there is much more to that tragedy then we were told.

I have spent close to 200 hours researching Pearl Harbor and there is no doubt that FDR had foreknowledge of an attack. While it can be debated if FDR knew Pearl was the target, this is a debate for fools, as the evidence shows that Pearl was the most likely target.

It took over 40 years for the McCollum memo to be declassified. Maybe 40 years from now eveidence will be declassified showing that the US government had foreknowledge of the 911 attacks. Until then, keep allowing the media to tell you what to think. It works well for you.

[Rankor and Pissing]

Norrin Radd wrote: What conspiracies have you researched?

I have spent 200 hours researching TWA 800 and it is an obvious coverup. I spent well over 100 hours researching the OKC bombing ...I have spent close to 200 hours researching Pearl Harbor Someone needs a new hobby. :roll:

Again, this is a need for life to be more interesting that it actually is.... being part of something bigger than oneself is also a big culprit as is trying to convince those who do not believe and attempting to "convert" them. I'll take a Jesus freak over Conspiracy wierdo's any day.

Ultimately... what is your goal for all this research? Is it personal satisfaction in a belief that cannot be proven? Because there's something called "Christianity" that has a much longer and solid base to consider and I hear it also provides "ever lasting life in the house of the Lord". TWA 800, JFK and OKC won't give you squat - unless hearing the word "Conspiracy Nut, Kook, Wierdo,..." (you get the idea) is somehow satisfying.

[gemma]

cap'n queasy wrote: I'll just say this.

Conspiracy theories put Hitler into power.

Something to think about.

Godwin's Law?


Anyway, I just shudder at the thought of all the Americans who believe that a) the government never lies and you must not question; b) documents are always stamped "classifed" in your best interests; and c) "official" reports are good as gospel.

Not that I'm putting any stock in any particular theory; but there have been very good occasions to question those in power, all through history, and even more recently in this country. Covering up incompetence or complicity, amounts to lying in either case.

[Patriot911]

gemma wrote: cap'n queasy wrote: I'll just say this.

Conspiracy theories put Hitler into power.

Something to think about.

Godwin's Law?


Anyway, I just shudder at the thought of all the Americans who believe that a) the government never lies and you must not question; b) documents are always stamped "classifed" in your best interests; and c) "official" reports are good as gospel.

Not that I'm putting any stock in any particular theory; but there have been very good occasions to question those in power, all through history, and even more recently in this country. Covering up incompetence or complicity, amounts to lying in either case.

I would agree. We should always question the government. HOWEVER we should also not automatically the government is behind every evil in the world either. If we look at the evidence at hand for 9/11 and then compare the two "theories", the official theory fits very tightly to the evidence while the conspiracy theory might occasionally brush against a fact or two, but I am beginning to believe this is purely by accident.

Many of the 9/11 conspiracy theorists have an agenda that has nothing to do with getting to the truth but instead proving the government was behind everything regardless of the truth.

[Norrin Radd]

Rankor and Pissing wrote: Norrin Radd wrote: What conspiracies have you researched?

I have spent 200 hours researching TWA 800 and it is an obvious coverup. I spent well over 100 hours researching the OKC bombing ...I have spent close to 200 hours researching Pearl Harbor Someone needs a new hobby. :roll:

Again, this is a need for life to be more interesting that it actually is.... being part of something bigger than oneself is also a big culprit as is trying to convince those who do not believe and attempting to "convert" them. I'll take a Jesus freak over Conspiracy wierdo's any day.

Ultimately... what is your goal for all this research? Is it personal satisfaction in a belief that cannot be proven? Because there's something called "Christianity" that has a much longer and solid base to consider and I hear it also provides "ever lasting life in the house of the Lord". TWA 800, JFK and OKC won't give you squat - unless hearing the word "Conspiracy Nut, Kook, Wierdo,..." (you get the idea) is somehow satisfying.

DO YOU CARE ABOUT THE TRUTH?

Yes, or no?

I do care about the truth and this is the only goal of my research. It does not make me feel special, or better than anyone else. In fact, sometimes I wish I had never heard about these things, as I was much happier before I acquired internet access. I used to have some respect for my government, but the 87 page Senate report titled "Is Military Research Hazardous to Veteran's Health" changed all that.

Ever read that report?

No, I didn't think so.

Ever read about the radaition tests, especially the test where 11 veteransa were injected with plutonium? No, I didn't think you had.

Ever read about the aerial dissemination of biological simulants? No, I didn't think you had.

Did you know the government admitted to spraying biolgocal agents on it's own people? No, I didn't think you did.

TWA 800 is possibly the most obvious coverup of all time.

Foreknowledge of a Japanese attack on the US can be proven.

A coverup of the OKC bombing has been proven, but only to those who are willing to do the research.

If you go here, http://www.politicalcrossfire.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=50213&highlight=fdr+pearl

I proved FDR had foreknowledge of the attack.

As to the OKC bombing, Jayna Davis tried to give evidence to the FBI three times concerning this tragedy, but the FBI refused to accept it. Later, Jayna wrote a book showing her evidence. After reading the book, former CIA director Woolsey said..........

"When the full stories of these two incidents (1993 WTC Center bombing and 1995 Oklahoma City bombing) are finally told, those who permitted the investigations to stop short will owe big explanations to these two brave women (Middle East expert Laurie Mylroie and journalist Jayna Davis). And the nation will owe them a debt of gratitude."
- Former CIA Director James Woolsey,
Wall Street Journal, September 5, 2002

"Those who permitted the investigations stop short"?

What does that mean?

It means a coverup.

[Wizard From Oz]

Quote: Ever read about the aerial dissemination of biological simulants? No, I didn't think you had.


Hmmmm - now complete the story - In the two incidents. Oakland and New Jersy, how long was the conspiracy kept alive????

Quote: Foreknowledge of a Japanese attack on the US can be proven.



Oh geee - and no one saw the attack coming? The only thing the US got wrong was what Sunday it would occure, and the actual nature of the attack

[Rankor and Pissing]

Norrin Radd wrote: Rankor and Pissing wrote: Norrin Radd wrote: What conspiracies have you researched?

I have spent 200 hours researching TWA 800 and it is an obvious coverup. I spent well over 100 hours researching the OKC bombing ...I have spent close to 200 hours researching Pearl Harbor Someone needs a new hobby. :roll:

Again, this is a need for life to be more interesting that it actually is.... being part of something bigger than oneself is also a big culprit as is trying to convince those who do not believe and attempting to "convert" them. I'll take a Jesus freak over Conspiracy wierdo's any day.

Ultimately... what is your goal for all this research? Is it personal satisfaction in a belief that cannot be proven? Because there's something called "Christianity" that has a much longer and solid base to consider and I hear it also provides "ever lasting life in the house of the Lord". TWA 800, JFK and OKC won't give you squat - unless hearing the word "Conspiracy Nut, Kook, Wierdo,..." (you get the idea) is somehow satisfying.

DO YOU CARE ABOUT THE TRUTH?

Yes, or no?

I do care about the truth and this is the only goal of my research. It does not make me feel special, or better than anyone else. In fact, sometimes I wish I had never heard about these things, as I was much happier before I acquired internet access. I used to have some respect for my government, but the 87 page Senate report titled "Is Military Research Hazardous to Veteran's Health" changed all that.

Ever read that report?

No, I didn't think so.

Ever read about the radaition tests, especially the test where 11 veteransa were injected with plutonium? No, I didn't think you had.

Ever read about the aerial dissemination of biological simulants? No, I didn't think you had.

Did you know the government admitted to spraying biolgocal agents on it's own people? No, I didn't think you did.

TWA 800 is possibly the most obvious coverup of all time.

Foreknowledge of a Japanese attack on the US can be proven.

A coverup of the OKC bombing has been proven, but only to those who are willing to do the research.

If you go here, http://www.politicalcrossfire.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=50213&highlight=fdr+pearl

I proved FDR had foreknowledge of the attack.

As to the OKC bombing, Jayna Davis tried to give evidence to the FBI three times concerning this tragedy, but the FBI refused to accept it. Later, Jayna wrote a book showing her evidence. After reading the book, former CIA director Woolsey said..........

"When the full stories of these two incidents (1993 WTC Center bombing and 1995 Oklahoma City bombing) are finally told, those who permitted the investigations to stop short will owe big explanations to these two brave women (Middle East expert Laurie Mylroie and journalist Jayna Davis). And the nation will owe them a debt of gratitude."
- Former CIA Director James Woolsey,
Wall Street Journal, September 5, 2002

"Those who permitted the investigations stop short"?

What does that mean?

It means a coverup.

There are VERY good medications today... seek them out.

[The Comrade]

i had to wrap a whole roll of tinfoil around my head to keep your mind control rays from making me think that there is no 9/11 conspiracy.