Political Crossfire Forums

[Rannath]

Here are a few reforms I think should be done. One all the prime minister's money should be put into national coffers, if the country loses money so does the prime minister and when the country gains so does the PM, The PM doesn't have access to his money, and this includes material assets, such as his house. That would keep dept from happening. Next all 'traditional" positions should be abolished. Next if the country goes to war, the PM's family is on the front lines, this will stop unnessecary wars, and it would not apply to peackeeping missions or defense of country. Next Tax for the rich should be increased while tax for the poor is decreased.

Tell me
1) your changes to the gouvernment
2) what in my ideas won't work and why, or how to make it work
3) how you'd improve/change my ideas
and/or
4) why I'm stupid. Give logical reasons plz!

[Lancaster]

This is poissibly the stupidest idea I have ever heard. What about uncontrollable factors, like a great depression? are you honestly suggesting the PM should go into quadruple bancruptcy? and placing the family on the front lines? you sick idiot! in war sacrafices need to be made! and if the PM had his family on the front lines, don't you think that regiment would see very little action? this would ADD to the innefficiencies! I cannot believe you came up with this crap! and what if the PM's family was killed? you want to have someone that depressed and irrational in office? THINK THINGS THROUGH

[the hare]

Many things canada ought to do
1.get rid of the useless senate and governor general who get paid excessive amounts and contribute minimally. if anything at all.

2. lose all those crappy ties to the english monarchy... i mean come on those bastards sold us out many times to the americans, yet the americans were the ones who revolted against them in the first place.

3. Tarrif/tax the vejesus on our energy and water that we send to the states... y? because america is treating canada like a biatch with their illegal tarrifs on our softwood lumber.

4. legalize pot and embrace our number 1 industry.. dont believe me... look it up.

5. get rid of our joke military and replace it with a competent national guard.

6. Fix up the cnn rail...

7. sue the s**t out of the tobacco companies for health care costs and
then make cigarettes illegal(this one here is just me being bitter)

8. Dont ask any questions, just deport illegal immigrants. goodbye fob

9. introduce the single transeferable vote system to all levels of government.

there are many more but i cant think of them now

the hare

[CanadianForPeace]

Rannath wrote: Here are a few reforms I think should be done. One all the prime minister's money should be put into national coffers, if the country loses money so does the prime minister and when the country gains so does the PM, The PM doesn't have access to his money, and this includes material assets, such as his house. That would keep dept from happening. Next all 'traditional" positions should be abolished. Next if the country goes to war, the PM's family is on the front lines, this will stop unnessecary wars, and it would not apply to peackeeping missions or defense of country. Next Tax for the rich should be increased while tax for the poor is decreased.

Tell me
1) your changes to the gouvernment
2) what in my ideas won't work and why, or how to make it work
3) how you'd improve/change my ideas
and/or
4) why I'm stupid. Give logical reasons plz!

It isn't logical to have the Prime Minister's money be the same as that of the country; sometimes running a deficit budget becomes necessary, and Canada's national debt isn't going to go away anytime soon. A limited form of this has been instituted in British Columbia, where if one of the Ministries goes overbudget, the money it is overbudget by is removed from the salary of the Minister in charge. However, this can cause ministers to refrain from putting money into necessary projects, for fear of going overbudget.

I don't agree with your idea about war; a leader can't pay attention to what's going on at home if he's on the front lines, and it's unfair to the Prime Minister's family. It is also unneccessary - Canadians generally don't like us getting involved in wars, so the Prime Minster is already "threatened" with electoral defeat if he takes us into one that we decide isn't worth it.

Stronger graduated income tax is an idea I support, if we can do it in a way that doesn't drive the buisnesses out of the country, thus reducing the money gained from taxes rather than increasing it. I would add to that the suggestion of taxing "luxury" products such as junk food, designer clothers, luxury cars, SUVs, etc. more heavily. (And I say this as someone who LOVES junk food).

Beyond these things, I'd say my main priority is senate reform. Right now the Senate doesn't do anything, because it lacks the authority to do anything, because it isn't elected. Also, it's supposed to provide regional representation, but about half the seats in it are held by Ontario and Quebec. My suggestions would be:
- have an elected Senate with elections taking place every 6-8 years
- have the Senate be non-partisan
- have six senators per province and territory, possibly with each representing a certain region (yes, I know this seems ridiculous when you think of PEI having six Senators, but I think it's important to give the provinces equal representation)

[Lancaster]

CanadianForPeace wrote: Rannath wrote: Here are a few reforms I think should be done. One all the prime minister's money should be put into national coffers, if the country loses money so does the prime minister and when the country gains so does the PM, The PM doesn't have access to his money, and this includes material assets, such as his house. That would keep dept from happening. Next all 'traditional" positions should be abolished. Next if the country goes to war, the PM's family is on the front lines, this will stop unnessecary wars, and it would not apply to peackeeping missions or defense of country. Next Tax for the rich should be increased while tax for the poor is decreased.

Tell me
1) your changes to the gouvernment
2) what in my ideas won't work and why, or how to make it work
3) how you'd improve/change my ideas
and/or
4) why I'm stupid. Give logical reasons plz!

It isn't logical to have the Prime Minister's money be the same as that of the country; sometimes running a deficit budget becomes necessary, and Canada's national debt isn't going to go away anytime soon. A limited form of this has been instituted in British Columbia, where if one of the Ministries goes overbudget, the money it is overbudget by is removed from the salary of the Minister in charge. However, this can cause ministers to refrain from putting money into necessary projects, for fear of going overbudget.

I don't agree with your idea about war; a leader can't pay attention to what's going on at home if he's on the front lines, and it's unfair to the Prime Minister's family. It is also unneccessary - Canadians generally don't like us getting involved in wars, so the Prime Minster is already "threatened" with electoral defeat if he takes us into one that we decide isn't worth it.

Stronger graduated income tax is an idea I support, if we can do it in a way that doesn't drive the buisnesses out of the country, thus reducing the money gained from taxes rather than increasing it. I would add to that the suggestion of taxing "luxury" products such as junk food, designer clothers, luxury cars, SUVs, etc. more heavily. (And I say this as someone who LOVES junk food).

Beyond these things, I'd say my main priority is senate reform. Right now the Senate doesn't do anything, because it lacks the authority to do anything, because it isn't elected. Also, it's supposed to provide regional representation, but about half the seats in it are held by Ontario and Quebec. My suggestions would be:
- have an elected Senate with elections taking place every 6-8 years
- have the Senate be non-partisan
- have six senators per province and territory, possibly with each representing a certain region (yes, I know this seems ridiculous when you think of PEI having six Senators, but I think it's important to give the provinces equal representation)

Yo, good Idea about the senate, especially the non-partisan thing. I'm a little interested how you would include the territories, I mean taking 6 people from NWT would half it's population :lol:

Seriously though I like your idea for the senate, but I would consider raising the terms to 8 years, as traditionally a senator has been a life-long career, and it would also relieve some of their pressure to maintain an active role, be non partisan AND run in elections...

One thing you didn't address is the power of the new senate, what would they be? replacing a useless collection of seniors with another useless collection of seniors is just a bad idea. Personally, I would think they should have the ability to propose legislature, but not vote on them (as this is the job of commons).

[thundertaker]

Have a permanent commision oversee the appointment of Senators from all walks of life to the senate to scrutinise government legislation from the Commons, and amend or send it back if neccessary. This is how I would like the British House of Lords to be reformed. I don't see why it couldn't work for Canada either.

BTW, what's all this about the 'English' Monarchy selling out to the americans? Could you elaborate? My first instinct is to call 'bollocks' on you, but then I thought I'd like to hear what the Royals have supposed to have done first.......

[gary the cheater]

i think we need proportional representation. we need a greater diversity in our parliament. it's ridiculous that in a country as diverse as canada, we have only four major parties and a handful of independents representing us in parliament. there should be parties to represent women, environmental, and aboriginal issues as well as many others.


voting in the conservative party because we want to punish the liberals for stealing is not democracy.

[thundertaker]

gary the cheater wrote: i think we need proportional representation. we need a greater diversity in our parliament. it's ridiculous that in a country as diverse as canada, we have only four major parties and a handful of independents representing us in parliament. there should be parties to represent women, environmental, and aboriginal issues as well as many others.


voting in the conservative party because we want to punish the liberals for stealing is not democracy.

How will PR change the absurdly strict party discipline in Canada? If anything, it will make the situation worse, because constituents will end up having to vote for the party, rather than the individual that will represent them in parliament......

[gary the cheater]

regional representation rewards the mainstream parties, and reinforces the party discipline that keeps them mainstream. especially in a country like canada where ridings are further concentrated by region and province.

it particularly benefits the liberals who are more pragmatic in their philosophy and not immune to spreading around some cash when it can help them in an election. elections that can give a majority government to a party even if it recieves less than 40% of the popular vote. a system that is not only patently undemocratic, but tremendously unfair to the fringe issues such as minorities or the environment, that are all too often ignored in favour of reaching a consensus

liberals enacted a few enormously unpopular measures under these questionable 40% majorities. particularly gun control and unemployment insurance reform. gun control not going over well in the west and rural areas of the country where urban crime isn't as serious as it is in toronto or quebec after the montreal massacre. and employment insurance being a major issue in the maritimes where it is a life saver in many communities with only marginal and seasonal employment opportunities.

but these recieved little attention because unrest was contained in regions that are outside the densely populated central canada liberal support base. only now with their minority government in jeopardy, are liberals again pumping money into employment insurance, in an effort to gain seats in the maritimes

but with only a handful of western MP's in their caucus, the liberals could not only afford to alienate western canada voters, but these voters could be counted on to elect a very reactionary right-wing populist opposition party that only reinforced the image of a liberal mainstream party.

i think that had the 1/4-1/3 support liberals still enjoy in the west, and a similar measure of support for conservatives in the middle, actually meant something in terms of proportional representation, parties wouldn't be so quick to ignore different groups of people and entire regions, in favour of their version of a national consensus.

conservatives tend to be more philosophical in their values, especially in their support for business and provincial rights. but even here they have to mute members that are more vocal on social issues such as abortion, gay marriage and crime. their biggest problem is the liberals aren't that far off base when it comes to business issues, pushing for tax cuts and a social contract that tends to favour the middle class as well as business that enjoys the benefit of subsidies to workers health and education, as well as their own industries. the conservatives problem is that the issue of tax cuts doesn't appeal to a working class that enjoys the protections of programs like health care, unemployment insurance, child benefits, while higher income earners are like most canadians, mostly urban, and not that drawn to the social conservatism. yes i want a tax cut and i think there's enough waste to be eliminated that we can afford one. but last thing i want is some messy abortion/homo/jesus debate driving a wedge right thru the middle of the country and saying goodbye to quebec when they decide they no longer want any part of it.

also, the formation of the bloc quebecois regional party didn't just cut the conservative party in half, but shifted the political to the west geographically, and to the right politically. for a while they were nothing more than a western regional party, taking their turn with the bloc as the government opposition while the liberals assumed occupancy of the centre.

though i'm aware that Proportional rep. has it faults that i won't list here, i think we benefit from having more voices in parliament, and not just the lone voice of whatever establishment party has a majority. i think parliament acted very well when mr. layton traded his party's support for the liberal budget in turn for rescinding a corporate tax cut and putting money towards health and social welfare. this seems to be common practice in many european proportional democracies, but here the move was slandered by the corporate media, completely ignorant of hte fact that mr layton's small social democrat party, still enjoys wide popular support from canadians, despite the disadvantages imposed by the electoral system. canadians as well, often forget that our most cherished programs were not the product of liberal governments, but minority governments that needed NDP support and have tossed the working class a bone now and then in trade.

[dcoltonbrown]

canadianpoliticsonline.com

[ddr_freak]

I believe in the triple E senate Thats the first thing that needs reformed
Next thing that needs changed in The Bloc. WTF does a Separatist party have to do with a CANADIAN government
Next thing will involve all of Canada, Send the Liberal crooks to jail, and elect a smarter more efficient, economic libel government. Right now thats the Conservative party, so on jan 23rd vote Conservative, it only makes sense

You say tax the Rich..... Saskatchewan did it now we suck. Alberta cut taxes, backed privatization now their CONSERVATIVE government has more and better social programs then SOCIALIST Saskatchewan, come on get a life.

The only way to get better social programs is though economic conservatism

[Biffo]

the hare wrote: Many things canada ought to do
1.get rid of the useless senate and governor general who get paid excessive amounts and contribute minimally. if anything at all.

2. lose all those crappy ties to the english monarchy... i mean come on those bastards sold us out many times to the americans, yet the americans were the ones who revolted against them in the first place.

3. Tarrif/tax the vejesus on our energy and water that we send to the states... y? because america is treating canada like a biatch with their illegal tarrifs on our softwood lumber.

4. legalize pot and embrace our number 1 industry.. dont believe me... look it up.

5. get rid of our joke military and replace it with a competent national guard.

6. Fix up the cnn rail...

7. sue the s**t out of the tobacco companies for health care costs and
then make cigarettes illegal(this one here is just me being bitter)

8. Dont ask any questions, just deport illegal immigrants. goodbye fob

9. introduce the single transeferable vote system to all levels of government.

there are many more but i cant think of them now

the hare

I agree tons with the Hare. The Senate and governer general are usueless. The Senate doesnt have any balls to stand up against the Parliament to actually be a proper legislature. Yes! Embrace pot! I agree, Canada is having lots of trouble with this stuff. Embrance it and the problems go away. Marijuana isnt as bad as many other drugs. Alcohol and cigarettes are considered drugs yet they are legal. Forget about Monarchy, Canada should be a true constitutional state instead of an acting Head of State who has no power but veto and the useless Governer General who represents the Monarchy in Canada. Take a tough stand on illegal immagrants because they starting trouble everywhere including my beloved Toronto. I agree about the CNN rail, its almost defunct. Stop becoming America's biatch.

But what I think is even more important is to federalize things a bit. MAny provinces are drowning in finacial or infrastructure problem because of the Municipal v. Provincial provincial system because they just wont stop b*tching to each other about whose responsibility is whos to hand this sh*t and that.

[gary the cheater]

senate reform = privatization

what the conservatives in this country want is a senate controlled by the provincial governments. that will throw a monkey wrench into any federal equalization program that composes the canadian social safety net.

interview with PET.
http://archives.cbc.ca/IDCC-1-74-368-2083/life_society/frum/

[Tayler Morin]

Let me put this blandly: Canada is very dumb right now. Here are steps to change that.

1) Make all military over seas come back, they are not helping defend our nation by killing Afganis or Iraqies

2) Make marajauan legal as booze, it does not have nearly as many medical problems and is very much out national number one export.

3) Make our own everything, eleminating from our need to import. If we disregaurd that we can make every industry public and do so, our nation will prosper in the decades to come.

4) Eliminate all the parts of our gov't which are really unnessisary, the G. General, the senate ect. This way we can put back into things like healthcare and education.

If this is wrong, I think you are wrong. That's politics for you.

-T

[gary the cheater]

Tayler Morin wrote: Let me put this blandly: Canada is very dumb right now. Here are steps to change that.

1) Make all military over seas come back, they are not helping defend our nation by killing Afganis or Iraqies
absolutely

2) Make marajauan legal as booze, it does not have nearly as many medical problems and is very much out national number one export.
yes

3) Make our own everything, eleminating from our need to import. If we disregaurd that we can make every industry public and do so, our nation will prosper in the decades to come.

maybe. venezuela is trading their oil for cuban doctors. we need doctors. alberta has oil. why aren't we importing venezuelan doctors? why should all our oil be sold to the americans if we can get a better deal elsewhere? i'm open to all sorts of alternatives to our current trading position.

4) Eliminate all the parts of our gov't which are really unnessisary, the G. General, the senate ect. This way we can put back into things like healthcare and education.

keep that the way it is. but declare the US federal drug czar persona non grata.

If this is wrong, I think you are wrong. That's politics for you.

yup

-T

[thundertaker]

The GG acts as a check on the PM's power. Doing away with them would be stupid......

[Sparkalinda]

the hare wrote: Many things canada ought to do

1.get rid of the useless senate and governor general who get paid excessive amounts and contribute minimally. if anything at all.



The single best place to start making changes. The Senate is a stupidest waste of freaking money on the face of this earth.

[gary the cheater]

the senate does not need to be reformed. and reform is totally the wrong word for what the right wants to do to the canadian senate.

what the conservatives mean by senate reform is a senate that can be controlled by the provinces; by allowing the provincial government to hold elections for senate posts. this is already messed up. you'll notice that every time alberta elects a senator in waiting, it's not the federal elections authority that runs the election but the alberta government. instead of having a more democratic, elected, senate, you get a federal government where the provincial government controls the senate.

the problem is that almost all of the various provincial social programs operate under a federal mandate. the federal government has the tax powers so it raises the revenues the provinces need to administer the social welfare programs that fall under their provincial powers. it was just an accident of history that the provinces ended up with all the expensive responsibilities like health and education while the feds got all the tax powers. so we've always had accords between the different governments to run our social services.

a simple way to undermine this system is to allow the provinces to control the senate. if they block enough spending, provincial services will suffer because they're not getting the money they need to maintain their programs. meanwhile the provincial governments in the richer provinces will be able to point out how they would be able to spend all that money if they could just get it back from the evil federal government.

nobody will bother to explain that the reason hospitals aren't getting money is because the provincially controlled senate is tying up the money.

you only have to understand the constitution to realize how stupid senate reform is. for one we have provincial governments for a reason. to allow the provinces to manage their local affairs, and the federal government to run national affairs. this system is antagonistic enough as it is. why would you want to make it worse by giving one level of government power over the other?

[pcc4life]

first thin g is senate reform 4 senotors per province and one per territory
dont legalize pot just decrimlize it because once it can be taxed its just one more thing that we will be abused by 200% tax going to the gov't
partial privatizational of health care the average person can afford proper health care

[Canada_Rocks]

At this very moment. i am embarrassed to be Canadian.