Political Crossfire Forums

[David Kelly]

The Roman Republic/Empire. A vast and great land. It united the known western world and parts of the mid east in a single and for the most part free nation.

The United States of America. A small seaside confederation of republics that grew into a world power uniting most of North America and the Pacific in a single and for the most part free federation. It can be best noted for 2 reasons. The beginning of the end of the British Empire and the only political/military force to conquer the great and proud Japanese Empire.

A republic and a federation of republics that throw off a king. A republic and a federation of republics that built 2 of the greatest empires. 2 civilizations that glorified the Greeks. Both reached the pinnacle of power with freedom at the helm and both started on there decline when corruption seeped into the hollowed halls of there respective Senates.

So, is America and Rome one and the same. The forefathers intended for America to be the new Rome after all, do you think there master plane worked for better or worse?

[thehollowman]

So far so good, but when your on top of the world the only place to go is down.

[LostSoul3412]

There is no "New Rome" because there is still an "Old Rome".

America is America and Italy is Italy.

[cap'n queasy]

In many ways Europe itself is still Roman underneath the veneer of modern civilization. And through the US's European cultural connection, so is the US.

The Holy Roman Empire did not end until 1806 when Napoleon disbanded it, after all.

To this day there are thousands of old Roman customs and superstitions etc being practiced throughout Western civilization. We even still look to the Greeks as the masters of classical civilization, and our ideal, just as our Roman forebears did.

[David Kelly]

LostSoul3412 wrote: There is no "New Rome" because there is still an "Old Rome".

America is America and Italy is Italy.

Ya, and Galh was Galh and Italy was Italy, didn't stop the Galhs from being part of the Roman Republic/empire now did it? :lol:

[LostSoul3412]

David Kelly wrote: Ya, and Galh was Galh and Italy was Italy, didn't stop the Galhs from being part of the Roman Republic/empire now did it? :lol:

As soon as the United States annexes Rome, your argument will be valid.

[Roman]

No, we're definately not Rome but have sturctured our civilzation off theirs in my opinion.

Rome was based on military strength, technology, art & entertainment, and economics; the same as us.
What did they offer modern civilization? Roads, plumbing, welfare, firemen, stadiums.
What did we offer modern civilization? Computers, telephones, electricity, cars, airplanes.

Also, Rome expanded its empire for security issues which may be similiar to what we are doig now in the war on terror.

These are striking similarities but the end is not nigh my friend!

Rome went through many series of up and downs before disappearing as with all civilizations. Could you name a culture or civilization that has continually inclined without a decline? Its impossible, there is none! Rome ruled over a thousand years and had to contually adapt to face new challeneges, therefore, their success may better be described as wave shown by line chart. For example, a line chart of our economy will have many up and downs but overall a steady incline. To simplifiy Rome or the U.S. as a consistant incline then decline doesn't present an accurate picture.

[melchizedek22]

America is the Last Great Empire,called The Revived Roman Empire by Bible schlors!

[Cyro]

LostSoul3412 wrote: David Kelly wrote: Ya, and Galh was Galh and Italy was Italy, didn't stop the Galhs from being part of the Roman Republic/empire now did it? :lol:

As soon as the United States annexes Rome, your argument will be valid.

I believe a better way to phrase the the question would be;

"Is America the new powerhouse empire of the world, as Rome was 2 thousand years ago?"

[melchizedek22]

Cyro wrote: LostSoul3412 wrote: David Kelly wrote: Ya, and Galh was Galh and Italy was Italy, didn't stop the Galhs from being part of the Roman Republic/empire now did it? :lol:

As soon as the United States annexes Rome, your argument will be valid.

I believe a better way to phrase the the question would be;

"Is America the new powerhouse empire of the world, as Rome was 2 thousand years ago?"
America is Modern day Rome,and modern day Bablyon,or "The w**** of Bablyon"

[David Kelly]

It seems some of you think I mean are we Rome proper. I mean are we Rome as in part of Roman civilization.

[Roman]

melchizedek22 wrote: America is the Last Great Empire,called The Revived Roman Empire by Bible schlors!

Wouldn't it make more sense that the EU would be the revised Roman Empire?

[cap'n queasy]

David Kelly wrote: It seems some of you think I mean are we Rome proper. I mean are we Rome as in part of Roman civilization.

I would say that in a very real sense we are.

Much of our culture and civilization is still based on the philosophy of Classical Greece, just as it was in the day of the Roman Empire. Barbarian European tribes adopted Roman culture and literally conquered and became the Roman Empire, this in turn, over the centuries, transformed into Christendom. During this period each of the peoples that came from the earlier barbarian tribes which became the modern nations of Europe had their period of ascendancy. The English, French, German, Spanish, Dutch, Italian, Polish, Hungarian, Greek, and Scandinavians took turns having their great Empires, eventually coalescing into the modern European Union. The US is an colonial offshoot from the various European nations and has many of the same core cultural traditions and values that can be traced directly back to Roman culture that spawned modern European culture.

So, in short the culture of the US is a later development of Roman civilization. Not another distinct civilization in itself.

Possibly archaeologists in the distant future, if any there be, will classify it this way after they analyze the dusty ruins of the good old USA.

After all, in many cases, our own archaeologists consider some peoples that lived thousands of miles and thousands of years apart as being all part of the same civilization.

[cap'n queasy]

Roman wrote: melchizedek22 wrote: America is the Last Great Empire,called The Revived Roman Empire by Bible schlors!

Wouldn't it make more sense that the EU would be the revised Roman Empire?

Speaking from a scriptural standpoint with a historical perspective I would say the "revived" Roman empire would have be a coalition of Europe and the Muslim lands.

Apparently the capital of such a coalition would be in Babylon, which incendently, was in the process of being rebuilt unil the war interupted it.

I think the scripture possibly describes the eventual conquest of Europe by the Muslims. Or possibly some sort of coalition.

Several Roman emperors were Arabic.

Look at this map.


It is not difficult to imagine the Muslim empire adding Europe to the green area.

[The Impeacher]

David Kelly wrote: It seems some of you think I mean are we Rome proper. I mean are we Rome as in part of Roman civilization.

You mean the Rome that was Greko-Roman and "borrowed" most of its culture from Greece and the ancient city-states?

In the sense that you would also include Athenian democracy as a part of Rome, although it is pre-Roman Republic... in meaning a continuation of Pan-Hellenic thought....

then I could generally agree with you.

Otherwise, no.

[David Kelly]

It seem to be 50/50.

[Dr. Wojtyla]

David Kelly wrote: The forefathers intended for America to be the new Rome after all,


What the f**k?

[Dr. Wojtyla]

The Impeacher wrote: David Kelly wrote: It seems some of you think I mean are we Rome proper. I mean are we Rome as in part of Roman civilization.

You mean the Rome that was Greko-Roman and "borrowed" most of its culture from Greece and the ancient city-states?





Yeah. Shouldn't the question be "Is America Greece?"

[Rilzic]

It is scary how much America borrowed from Rome.

as Voltaire described it the HRE was “neither holy, nor Roman, nor an empire"

Europe is not nearly as roman as america. And yes rome very much lives on in america and western culture.

[David Kelly]

Were even following the same histroy (Albe it, it's been better for us.)
Rome had a king, America had a king. (So far no king unlike Rome following Cezer's murder.)
Rome invades Germany, America invades Germany. (We won, Rome lost and was annialated as a nation.)
That's just a small list.