Political Crossfire Forums

MoscowMatt · Joined: 16 Sep 2005 Posts: 1647 Location: UK / Hungary

SpartanPhalanx wrote: maalox wrote: i hope that israel attacks Iran and Syria , so they can get some extra rockets :D:D:D:D

Now we know why Iran needs a nuclear deterrent. If they had the bomb, The Israeli pit-bull would be in its kennel, tied up, safe from the neighbourhood.

Not really. Nuclear weapons only give you security from nations that have none.

cogent · Joined: 15 Jul 2006 Posts: 41 Location: beirut

nuclear weapons don't give you any sort of security
cuz if you use them
other nuclear countries eventhough they have nothing to do with the conflict
will have to fire back in turns
GENOCIDE IS not an option
thus no nuclear weapon will ever be fired at a country ever again
at least i think so :P

superskippy · Joined: 14 Jul 2005 Posts: 8672 Location: Petah Tikva

cogent wrote: nuclear weapons don't give you any sort of security
cuz if you use them
other nuclear countries eventhough they have nothing to do with the conflict
will have to fire back in turns
GENOCIDE IS not an option
thus no nuclear weapon will ever be fired at a country ever again
at least i think so :P

Yes they do. You cannot ever survive an attempt to destroy a nuclear armed nation if that nation so chooses.

In 1973 when for a few days we though the potential for defeat on the ground might be possible we armed 21, 13 kilotonic nuclear weapons and had the worst occured, Egypt and Syria would have ceased to be.

Nuclear Weapons are not meant for threats or for political muscling through, they are meant to assure that if attacked by a non nuclear power you can annihilate them if required. And if by a nuclear power you can destroy them as well, negating the possability of such an attack.

nrhy · Joined: 02 Feb 2006 Posts: 697 Location: Spain

Quote: Defeated us? I really must have missed a few years of my life, care to elaborate?

During lebanese civilwar. Israel retreated from the south because of effective attacks conducted on them, by hizbullah (and barely any losses on hizbullah´s side). Also, If you looked that far back superskippy, that was when the IDF was a big joke(terrorist acts vs the lebanese civilians).

maalox · Joined: 18 Jul 2006 Posts: 133 Location: above u

man , let him beleive what his filthy gouverment says

superskippy · Joined: 14 Jul 2005 Posts: 8672 Location: Petah Tikva

Quote: During lebanese civilwar. Israel retreated from the south because of effective attacks conducted on them, by hizbullah (and barely any losses on hizbullah´s side). Also, If you looked that far back superskippy, that was when the IDF was a big joke(terrorist acts vs the lebanese civilians).

Eh? We maintained a small force inside the souther end of South Lebanon for the purpose of keeping a buffer. We were supporting the SLA against Hezbollah and other militia to keep the attacks against us down.

Hezbollah did very few casualties to the IDF when compared to the close to 20 years we spent there.

We withdrew of our own accord, the diplomatic reasons became more prevalent and paid off in that regard, at the time we had done all the damage we could have hoped to do, and probably one of the more major reasons was the dissolving nature of the SLA.

nrhy · Joined: 02 Feb 2006 Posts: 697 Location: Spain

you guys came in to support the lebanese kataeb. They got their asses kicked, and then the israelis started to have their own share of enemies. Suicide and normal planted bombings were conducted on israeli bases or facilities in lebanon near Beirut (where hizbullah first emerged). Slowly they retreated and made a stand in the south. Because of overwhelming casualties (both diplomatic and military), they retreated.

Skywalker · Joined: 22 Jul 2006 Posts: 29

guys guys take it easy!!!

first of all... that's some pure bulls**t cause ur source my friend www.free-lebanon.com is one hell of a sectarian website that shows nothing but hatred towards hezballah and btw they got their info from a high commander in israel who said that iranians troops are aiding hezballah after the surprise attack of the I"D"F ship. so when the guys from www.free-lebanon.com heard that they rushed into putting this news on their website since they'll do anything to involve iran and inthe future syria cause they hate them a lot... i have friends like that so that's y i know what im talking about...

superskippy · Joined: 14 Jul 2005 Posts: 8672 Location: Petah Tikva

nrhy wrote: you guys came in to support the lebanese kataeb. They got their asses kicked, and then the israelis started to have their own share of enemies. Suicide and normal planted bombings were conducted on israeli bases or facilities in lebanon near Beirut (where hizbullah first emerged). Slowly they retreated and made a stand in the south. Because of overwhelming casualties (both diplomatic and military), they retreated.

Can you cite these overwhelming casualties? We didnt suffer these huge losses as you claim, we held a rather safe position. What made the choice for us to withdraw as the fact that we had nothing left to really gain by remaining unless we wanted to move an Army in .

maalox · Joined: 18 Jul 2006 Posts: 133 Location: above u

i insist , Iran will kick Israel`s ass

SpartanPhalanx · Joined: 13 Jul 2004 Posts: 2198 Location: 3rd rock

MoscowMatt wrote: SpartanPhalanx wrote: maalox wrote: i hope that israel attacks Iran and Syria , so they can get some extra rockets :D:D:D:D

Now we know why Iran needs a nuclear deterrent. If they had the bomb, The Israeli pit-bull would be in its kennel, tied up, safe from the neighbourhood.

Not really. Nuclear weapons only give you security from nations that have none.

I've seen some ludicrous posts around here, but your above takes the cake.

Remember the cold war?

Pelagius · Joined: 11 Feb 2005 Posts: 888

lester1/2jr wrote: oh yeah I"M the warmonger. any war would obviously be contingent on a "pre emptive " attack by Israeli planes

Why let Israel have all the fun? Any pre-emptive attack ought to carried out by the US.

the truth · Posted: Sun Jul 23, 2006 7:36 pm Post subject:

maalox wrote: i insist , Iran will kick Israel`s ass

If Iran attacks Israel, the US will make sure Iran is uninhabitable for the next 50 years. Iran will do nothing, and they will give up the nuke program because at the end of the day, they are nothing compared to aWestern military.

Iran couldn't defeat Israel 1 on 1 period.

nrhy · Joined: 02 Feb 2006 Posts: 697 Location: Spain

superskippy wrote: nrhy wrote: you guys came in to support the lebanese kataeb. They got their asses kicked, and then the israelis started to have their own share of enemies. Suicide and normal planted bombings were conducted on israeli bases or facilities in lebanon near Beirut (where hizbullah first emerged). Slowly they retreated and made a stand in the south. Because of overwhelming casualties (both diplomatic and military), they retreated.

Can you cite these overwhelming casualties? We didnt suffer these huge losses as you claim, we held a rather safe position. What made the choice for us to withdraw as the fact that we had nothing left to really gain by remaining unless we wanted to move an Army in .

by 1983 israel had lost 455 soldiers and 2460 wounded. And that was before hizbullah came up.

superskippy · Joined: 14 Jul 2005 Posts: 8672 Location: Petah Tikva

And in total we lost 675 soldiers, this is from 1982-2000. By 1985 we withdrew from Lebanon occupying 20km security zone. Our casualties were extremely minimal if you had to break it down it would be less than 8-10 a year.

vadardenza · Joined: 24 Jul 2006 Posts: 7

"Nuclear Weapons are not meant for threats or for political muscling through, they are meant to assure that if attacked by a non nuclear power you can annihilate them if required"

They are also needed to avoid being attacked period. That is why Pakistan and India developed them, that is why North Korea has developed them, that is why Iran will develop them.

That is why many non-nuclear European countries maintain the ability to produce nukes on a moment's notice. The Netherlands, Germany, Italy are known to have this capability, probably Switzerland and others do too. As DeGaulle said when he built the French "Force de Frappe" , France does not have to have the capability to destroy all nuclear powers, just the one that tries to blackmail France.

superskippy · Joined: 14 Jul 2005 Posts: 8672 Location: Petah Tikva

Quote: They are also needed to avoid being attacked period. That is why Pakistan and India developed them, that is why North Korea has developed them, that is why Iran will develop them.

Yet they dont assure that, India and Pakistan fought a war that caused thousands of casualties a bare 7 years ago.

It isnt known whether North Korea has developed nuclear weapons, it would be a shame as it bolsters their horrible regime.

Quote: That is why many non-nuclear European countries maintain the ability to produce nukes on a moment's notice. The Netherlands, Germany, Italy are known to have this capability, probably Switzerland and others do too.

Your over reading into nations nuclear ambitions or reasoning, any nation that has any sort of duel use reactor or sufficient skill could create a nuclear weapon in between 1-2 years. The issue is building up the extra facilities required, and the billions and billions of dollars that it takes to make them.

henrilegrand · Joined: 22 Jul 2006 Posts: 186

[quote="the truth"][quote="maalox"]i insist , Iran will kick Israel`s ass[/quote]

If Iran attacks Israel, the US will make sure Iran is uninhabitable for the next 50 years. Iran will do nothing, and they will give up the nuke program because at the end of the day, they are nothing compared to aWestern military.

Iran couldn't defeat Israel 1 on 1 period.[/quote]

*****

>>They are nothing compared to a Western military<<

That's what Dubya also thought about Iraq : MISSION ACCOMPLISHED !

mai · Joined: 25 Jul 2006 Posts: 31 Location: Dubai

Do not under-estimate Iran. It is one of the most dangerous and powerful countries in the world. Just imagine the devistation if Israel took it 1on1 with Iran. If it gets THAT serious, nukes will be involved. Lets just call that the end of the world.

thatisnotme · Joined: 26 Mar 2006 Posts: 452

maalox wrote: i insist , Iran will kick Israel`s ass

As I wrote on another thread: To destroy Israel, one would need to destroy the US and Europe, which will never stand by and let the destruction of Israel take place. This a simple fact that obviously most Muslims don't understand, otherwise they would NOT encourage Hezbollah, Hamas and other terrorist groups whose sole aim is to destroy the state of Israel.

In the Lebanon crisis, the US and Israel don't want a truce or a cessation of hostility, not until Hezbollah is decimated and pushed farther to the north so that their rockets will not fall on Israeli soil. Hezbollah must understand that its military aim -- to destroy Israel --- is pure folly.