Political Crossfire Forums

ToonArmyIsComing · Joined: 15 Feb 2005 Posts: 5888 Location: Ontario

Are we about to witness the beginning of a new civil war in Lebanon with the Israeli incursions into Lebanon? Syria could potentially get involved. Iran will also be a party. And most importantly, Hezbollah and other militias are still armed to their teeth. But then again, it might be a bit premature.

Quote: Israel attacks Beirut's airport

Israeli aircraft have fired rockets at the runways of Beirut's international airport, forcing its closure and the diversion of flights.

It comes as 27 civilians, including 10 children, were killed in overnight Israeli raids on southern Lebanon.

Militant group Hezbollah retaliated by firing rockets into northern Israel. One person has been reported killed.

The violence follows the capture of two Israeli soldiers by Hezbollah. Israel has said it holds Lebanon responsible.

The Beirut airport is Lebanon's only international airport.

It is located in the Lebanese capital's Hezbollah-controlled southern suburbs.

'Weapons hub'

The Israeli military confirmed that its aircraft had struck the facility.

"The airport is used as a central hub for the transfer of weapons and supplies to the Hezbollah terrorist organisation," an Israeli army spokesman said.

Shortly after Israeli shells began falling on the runways early Thursday, a senior airport official announced the facility was closed and asked scheduled flights to divert to Cyprus.

There were no immediate reports of casualties at the airport.

Overnight raids

Israel said its jets also hit 40 Hezbollah targets in overnight raids.

At least 10 members of one family were reported killed in Dweir village.

Hezbollah guerrillas responded by firing volleys of rockets at the northern Israeli coastal town of Nahariya.

A 40-year-old woman was killed when her home was struck by a rocket, medics said. The Israeli military confirmed the death.

Israeli PM Ehud Olmert said the soldiers' capture was an "act of war", but Hezbollah leader Hassan Nasrallah insisted the two would only be returned via talks.

Mr Olmert said he held Beirut responsible, but Lebanese Prime Minister Fuad Siniora denied any knowledge of the Hezbollah operation and refused to take responsibility for the soldiers' capture.

Before targeting the airport, Israel launched night air strikes on bridges and roads in southern Lebanon. Many bridges were destroyed.

The BBC's Kim Ghattas in Beirut says it is the first time in a decade that Beirut airport had been hit by Israeli fire.

The airport, rebuilt after the civil war, is a symbol of national pride for the people of Lebanon, our correspondent adds.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/5175160.stm

Duchifas · Joined: 22 Jun 2004 Posts: 9950

ToonArmyIsComing wrote: Are we about to witness the beginning of a new civil war in Lebanon with the Israeli incursions into Lebanon? Syria could potentially get involved. Iran will also be a party. And most importantly, Hezbollah and other militias are still armed to their teeth. But then again, it might be a bit premature.

It was bound to happen. But there won't be a civil war. As I mentioned in the other thread, other Lebanese already hate Hizbollah. This is much unlike the case of Palestinians, who are in love with their Hamas, according to all votes and polls. Thus, while sending Palestinian people the message that they better change their ways has a chance of working. Sending this message to the Lebanese who already hate Hizbollah will not work. All it will do is unite them with Hizbollah against what they will see as unwarranted agression by Israel. There will not be a civil war. The non-shiites will not unite with Israel against Hizbollah, or act separately against Hizbollah when Israel is blocking their sea and air and bombing the crap out of them. If anything, they will unite with Hizbollah.

Common sense is a rare commodity among Israeli elected officials these days.

TacticalSniper · Posted: Thu Jul 13, 2006 5:42 am Post subject:

That's why it is important for Israel only to attacks areas Hezbollah are active in.

Seapearl · Posted: Thu Jul 13, 2006 7:24 am Post subject:

TacticalSniper wrote: That's why it is important for Israel only to attacks areas Hezbollah are active in.

Like the airport of Beyrout for instance??

My aunt and two cousins are there, visiting relatives for the marriage of one of my cousins. I would be there if I hadn't had to be here for my graduation....We heard civilians are killed and we are worried.....How can children and women have anything to do with Hizbollah?

Duchifas · Joined: 22 Jun 2004 Posts: 9950

Seapearl wrote: TacticalSniper wrote: That's why it is important for Israel only to attacks areas Hezbollah are active in.

Like the airport of Beyrout for instance??

My aunt and two cousins are there, visiting relatives for the marriage of one of my cousins. I would be there if I hadn't had to be here for my graduation....We heard civilians are killed and we are worried.....How can children and women have anything to do with Hizbollah?

If the women told their men to get off their lazy asses and start hanging Hezbollah terrorists on trees after Israel pulled out of Lebanon six years ago, then the women and their children wouldn't have much to worry about. Unfortunately, letting your country be hijacked by terrorists while doing nothing about tends to bring disastrous results. The Lebanese people have been warned for six years to put Hezbollah in check. For six years Israel held back.

While I don't think Israel's strategy is the wisest, I cannot share in your surprise, lamentations and worries. The time to worry was from 2000-2006. Unfortunately everyone was partying, having a good time, and letting Hizbollah do whatever the heck it wants. Well, now it's gonna suck.

lowchen · Joined: 19 Mar 2006 Posts: 421

TacticalSniper wrote: That's why it is important for Israel only to attacks areas Hezbollah are active in.

Oh yeah?? like an airport where civilians fly into? dont we usually categorize those who attack an airport TERRORISTS??? So how is this any different?

.locke. · Joined: 10 Jul 2006 Posts: 89 Location: southwest ohio

Seapearl wrote: TacticalSniper wrote: That's why it is important for Israel only to attacks areas Hezbollah are active in.

Like the airport of Beyrout for instance??

My aunt and two cousins are there, visiting relatives for the marriage of one of my cousins. I would be there if I hadn't had to be here for my graduation....We heard civilians are killed and we are worried.....How can children and women have anything to do with Hizbollah?

any military would hit the airport, its of strategic value. when terrorists are attackin its to kill civillians, when an ARMY attacks its to take control.

mendosan · Joined: 02 May 2006 Posts: 2735

It must be one of the biggest mistakes Israel has made pulling out of south Lebanon, I think that its proof disengagement will not work.

Rankor and Pissing · Joined: 04 Mar 2006 Posts: 10231

As soon as a little conflict rears it's head, the "Civil War" chicken littles pop up like mushrooms. There's no civil war people.

Duchifas · Joined: 22 Jun 2004 Posts: 9950

lowchen wrote: TacticalSniper wrote: That's why it is important for Israel only to attacks areas Hezbollah are active in.

Oh yeah?? like an airport where civilians fly into? dont we usually categorize those who attack an airport TERRORISTS??? So how is this any different?

We usually do. However, airports are usually not used to deliver weaponry to terrorists. The Beirut airport has been used for years to deliver rockets and other weapons to Hizbollah terrorists, and now those rockets are being used to shell civilian targets.

That's how this is different.

I wonder where your outrage was for the last six years when Hizbollah blatantly used civilian infrastructure to enhance its terror capabilities, while the rest of Lebanon and the international community sat quietly on the sidelines.

superskippy · Joined: 14 Jul 2005 Posts: 8672 Location: Petah Tikva

Its the main transit point for arms and supplies for both the Lebanese Army and Hizbollah factions. It's a major strategic point just as the Americans, Syrias, and Lebanese warring groups have tacitly accepted for the past 50 years.

We have also bombed Airforce bases and military formations this isnt an attack to punish the Lebanese people, we want to cripple the fighting capacity of Hizbollah and the LDF.

cap'n queasy · Joined: 15 May 2004 Posts: 34968

It's war, they attacked them. Can you expect anything else? That airport is a strategic target, where arms come in. You expect them to just let the guys who attacked them to resupply their armament?

That's not very realistic.

Seapearl · Posted: Thu Jul 13, 2006 10:47 am Post subject:

Duchifas wrote: Seapearl wrote: TacticalSniper wrote: That's why it is important for Israel only to attacks areas Hezbollah are active in.

Like the airport of Beyrout for instance??

My aunt and two cousins are there, visiting relatives for the marriage of one of my cousins. I would be there if I hadn't had to be here for my graduation....We heard civilians are killed and we are worried.....How can children and women have anything to do with Hizbollah?

If the women told their men to get off their lazy asses and start hanging Hezbollah terrorists on trees after Israel pulled out of Lebanon six years ago, then the women and their children wouldn't have much to worry about. Unfortunately, letting your country be hijacked by terrorists while doing nothing about tends to bring disastrous results. The Lebanese people have been warned for six years to put Hezbollah in check. For six years Israel held back.

While I don't think Israel's strategy is the wisest, I cannot share in your surprise, lamentations and worries. The time to worry was from 2000-2006. Unfortunately everyone was partying, having a good time, and letting Hizbollah do whatever the heck it wants. Well, now it's gonna suck.

How cynical and indifferent but really I didn't expect something different! It maybe normal for you not to feel anything about the people down there but I have relatives, honourable people leading a normal life, doing their business....Lebanon has always had a considerable greek community, some had to move during the war, this situation must surely devastate them....

As far as women and children are concerned, Israel must re-address it tactics.....Israel has NO right to punish a whole people for others' actions, let alone that in this way it gives birth to new terrorists.....If Israel wants to fight hizbollah, then it should, but really fight armed people not harmless, innocent ones.....it's silly and outraging....

MoscowMatt · Joined: 16 Sep 2005 Posts: 1647 Location: UK / Hungary

Seapearl wrote: How can children and women have anything to do with Hizbollah?

You tell me?!!!!

Duchifas · Joined: 22 Jun 2004 Posts: 9950

Seapearl wrote: How cynical and indifferent but really I didn't expect something different! It maybe normal for you not to feel anything about the people down there but I have relatives, honourable people leading a normal life, doing their business....Lebanon has always had a considerable greek community, some had to move during the war, this situation must surely devastate them....

I am cynical and indifferent? Where were you for the last six years since Israel pulled out of Lebanon to internationally recognized border and Lebanon continued allowing Hezbollah to stockpile rockets aimed at Israeli cities? Where were you when Hezbollah was arming and establishing itself, and Lebanon and everyone else sat around quietly doing nothing? Where were you when Hezbollah attacked Israel on previous occasions and kidnapped Israelis previously, and Israel only responded with restraint? Why were people like you cynical and indifferent for all that time? Why did people like you, who care so much about Lebanon, not put pressure on Lebanon to rid itself of the terrorist scourge of Hizbollah?

Indifferent? Pffft. Look who is talking.

Quote: As far as women and children are concerned, Israel must re-address it tactics.....Israel has NO right to punish a whole people for others' actions, let alone that in this way it gives birth to new terrorists.....If Israel wants to fight hizbollah, then it should, but really fight armed people not harmless, innocent ones.....it's silly and outraging....

I love it how on one side you have this entity "Israel" that is attacked. And on the other end, as soon as attacked, the entity is not "Lebanon" but is suddenly "women and children."

Let me remind you. Hizbollah rockets are not raining down on "Israel." They are raining down on men, women and children. One Israeli woman is dead already, her only crime enjoying a nice day on her balcony. Over ninety civilians are wounded. Northern part of the country (civilians) are in shelters. Kids can't play outside because rockets fall from the sky on their playgrounds. All that, you conveniently label as this vague entity "Israel." Very convenient.

Well, I can do the same. I also can come up with a very vague entity called "Lebanon" and I can pontificate to you that rockets are flying from "Lebanon" onto Israeli women and children. And for six years, "Lebanon" has done nothing to prevent this situation from erupting. FOr some reason, Israeli soldiers, with no provocation, were killed, and two kidnapped into "Lebanon." So while I appreciate that you are mindful of what "Israel" must do, I want to hear from you what "Lebanon" has to do.

Tell me, my un-cynical friend.

mendosan · Joined: 02 May 2006 Posts: 2735

Just heard a Rocket may have hit Haifa looks things are looking bad now, Israel is gonna have to destroy as much of Hezbollah as possible, this proves bombing the airport was justified if military supplies were going through it.

superskippy · Joined: 14 Jul 2005 Posts: 8672 Location: Petah Tikva

I think it did hit Haifa and other towns causing some casualties, I'm not sure of fatalities or certaintity that it hit.

Update: I just checked 3 dead and 140 wounded thus far. I'm going to be off for a little while to go outside and see what it looks like and yes it did hit.

mendosan · Joined: 02 May 2006 Posts: 2735

Do you think Israel is gonna have to mobilize up its reservists?

superskippy · Joined: 14 Jul 2005 Posts: 8672 Location: Petah Tikva

My last post for a bit, yes and we have already started calling up 10,000. I'm not among them as of yet.

Seapearl · Posted: Thu Jul 13, 2006 12:53 pm Post subject:

MoscowMatt wrote: Seapearl wrote: How can children and women have anything to do with Hizbollah?

You tell me?!!!!

The ones killed or the ones I saw on TV didn't carry guns, so please....