Political Crossfire Forums

LetsGetReal · Joined: 26 Aug 2004 Posts: 5791 Location: Peoria, AZ

If you would like to take this to a philosophical debate Descartes "Cartesian Doubt" I believe is the most superior proof of God. Also it develops the idea of uncertainity in all things including time.

topnut · Joined: 26 Jun 2006 Posts: 220

issaiah1332 wrote: And do you consider your views to be based on Zeno's or on block time?

They are simply my views...time does not exist, period.

issaiah1332 · Joined: 29 Jun 2006 Posts: 465 Location: Wv

LetsGetReal wrote: If you would like to take this to a philosophical debate Descartes "Cartesian Doubt" I believe is the most superior proof of God. Also it develops the idea of uncertainity in all things including time.

Are you responding to my post?

LetsGetReal · Joined: 26 Aug 2004 Posts: 5791 Location: Peoria, AZ

issaiah1332 wrote: LetsGetReal wrote: If you would like to take this to a philosophical debate Descartes "Cartesian Doubt" I believe is the most superior proof of God. Also it develops the idea of uncertainity in all things including time.

Are you responding to my post? In a way I was just interjecting another person who wrote about how everything can be uncertain or imaginative along with time.

issaiah1332 · Joined: 29 Jun 2006 Posts: 465 Location: Wv

topnut wrote: issaiah1332 wrote: And do you consider your views to be based on Zeno's or on block time?

They are simply my views...time does not exist, period.

What about my points? Do you wish not to acknowledge them?

topnut · Joined: 26 Jun 2006 Posts: 220

issaiah1332 wrote: topnut wrote: issaiah1332 wrote: And do you consider your views to be based on Zeno's or on block time?

They are simply my views...time does not exist, period.

What about my points? Do you wish not to acknowledge them?

they are tremendous points, however as you have unwavering faith in your bible, which no facts or logic will ever change, I too have unwavering faith in my theory relating to the absence of time.

issaiah1332 · Joined: 29 Jun 2006 Posts: 465 Location: Wv

topnut wrote: issaiah1332 wrote: topnut wrote: issaiah1332 wrote: And do you consider your views to be based on Zeno's or on block time?

They are simply my views...time does not exist, period.

What about my points? Do you wish not to acknowledge them?

they are tremendous points, however as you have unwavering faith in your bible, which no facts or logic will ever change, I too have unwavering faith in my theory relating to the absence of time.

I was making no reference to the Bible, I was speaking from a scientific point of view. I am very agnostic.

Hawkins · Joined: 14 Apr 2005 Posts: 289 Location: Hong Kong

politicalmojo wrote:
Because it exists outside the realm of our existence that we can manipulate. Can you prove to me that time travel is possible.

In a sense, I thought it was already proven. :lol:

I heard (sorry forgot where the source is) those astronauts stayed long enough in their spaceship experienced 1/50 second ahead of our time.

wormwood · Joined: 24 Sep 2005 Posts: 2670 Location: The P-Brane

Quote: How do you explain gravity and speed's changing of time? Damn...you beat me to it!

Aside from gravity, the argument is flawed in that it relies on sense experience and instrumentation...which is fine except that in topnut's world, bacteria did not exist before microscopes since bacteria could not be experienced by the 5 senses before then. In the long post which was cut and pasted, the author even admits there are facets to reality we can't detect yet, and in the same paragraph he says time is not real because it can not be experienced by the 5 senses.

issaiah1332 · Joined: 29 Jun 2006 Posts: 465 Location: Wv

wormwood wrote: Quote: How do you explain gravity and speed's changing of time? Damn...you beat me to it!

Aside from gravity, the argument is flawed in that it relies on sense experience and instrumentation...which is fine except that in topnut's world, bacteria did not exist before microscopes since bacteria could not be experienced by the 5 senses before then. In the long post which was cut and pasted, the author even admits there are facets to reality we can't detect yet, and in the same paragraph he says time is not real because it can not be experienced by the 5 senses.

True. I think that Topnut's view on time is severely flawed, and it is the exact same as Block Time, in which Block Time is still time none the less. Although it is a belief more in tune with simultaneity.

Hyde · Posted: Fri Jul 07, 2006 4:23 pm Post subject: Re: Time Travel and religion

LetsGetReal wrote: connermt wrote: Hyde wrote: LetsGetReal wrote: perdidochas wrote: toddytodd wrote: From a religious stand point, do you think time travel will be possible? Meaning if we could go back in time to the time of Christ, would God allow this? Would the christian outcome be any different? I have often wondered if humans advanced enough to travel through time, would God alow us to do so? Or will God allow us to advance enough to time travel?

I don't think time travel is possible..... It's not...

please prove to me that it is impossible rather than stating it as a fact.

LGR likes to saythings are facts w/o supply any info to support it. It's a bad habit of his I have found. Good luck getting any kind of proof out of 'im for this one! How about Einsteins proof that couldn't be done or the fact that effect can't pre-date cause.
first, it is a theory, not proof. and seeing how time travel hasnt been accomplished yet, i dont think we can know if effect can predate cause.

wormwood · Joined: 24 Sep 2005 Posts: 2670 Location: The P-Brane

One more point to refute topnut's expert:

He said that past and future don't exist because they cannot be experienced (which I could argue, because people can relive the past through a smell or a sound, and people will experience the future, so both can be experienced) and that the only moment that is real is right now. The problem with this is that there really is no instant of "right now". Even before the words "right now" can be uttered, the moment that inspired "right now" has passed. Since we can not experience frozen instants of time, we perpetually live in the past. By that I mean, once a moment has been recognized, it has passed. Even as I type this, the thoughts that inspired it are gone and replaced by task oriented thought and gross motor function. If I try to recognize a moment as "right now", that moment has passed once the synapses fire and my mind labels it. Just a thought.

toddytodd · Joined: 20 May 2006 Posts: 2736

Hyde wrote: LetsGetReal wrote: connermt wrote: Hyde wrote: LetsGetReal wrote: perdidochas wrote: toddytodd wrote: From a religious stand point, do you think time travel will be possible? Meaning if we could go back in time to the time of Christ, would God allow this? Would the christian outcome be any different? I have often wondered if humans advanced enough to travel through time, would God alow us to do so? Or will God allow us to advance enough to time travel?

I don't think time travel is possible..... It's not...

please prove to me that it is impossible rather than stating it as a fact.

LGR likes to saythings are facts w/o supply any info to support it. It's a bad habit of his I have found. Good luck getting any kind of proof out of 'im for this one! How about Einsteins proof that couldn't be done or the fact that effect can't pre-date cause.
first, it is a theory, not proof. and seeing how time travel hasnt been accomplished yet, i dont think we can know if effect can predate cause.

Quote: i dont think we can know if effect can predate cause. Or anything else about the truth of time travel, for that matter. It's way beyond our understanding at this point for sure.

LetsGetReal · Joined: 26 Aug 2004 Posts: 5791 Location: Peoria, AZ

For time Travel to occur backwards that would mean that in fact time is just a re-run would it not? Thats what I've always thought is the fundament flaw in time travel backwards and sorta forwards. And would you be a copy of yourself or your legitamate self, because in essence if you are rewinding time would you also rewind what you had done or what had occured prior to the time you came from?

toddytodd · Joined: 20 May 2006 Posts: 2736

LetsGetReal wrote: For time Travel to occur backwards that would mean that in fact time is just a re-run would it not? Thats what I've always thought is the fundament flaw in time travel backwards and sorta forwards. And would you be a copy of yourself or your legitamate self, because in essence if you are rewinding time would you also rewind what you had done or what had occured prior to the time you came from?

Some people believe that time travel isn't actually traveling back in time, but to other 'dimensions' which are on a different time line. How? Haven't a clue. :?
In an infinite universe, I suppose anything is possible though.

LetsGetReal · Joined: 26 Aug 2004 Posts: 5791 Location: Peoria, AZ

toddytodd wrote: LetsGetReal wrote: For time Travel to occur backwards that would mean that in fact time is just a re-run would it not? Thats what I've always thought is the fundament flaw in time travel backwards and sorta forwards. And would you be a copy of yourself or your legitamate self, because in essence if you are rewinding time would you also rewind what you had done or what had occured prior to the time you came from?

Some people believe that time travel isn't actually traveling back in time, but to other 'dimensions' which are on a different time line. How? Haven't a clue. :?
In an infinite universe, I suppose anything is possible though. I think thats fancy words to make something sound plausible when its not, but physics wasn't my subject because of concepts like this... I don't like dealing in an imaginary world but the real one..

toddytodd · Joined: 20 May 2006 Posts: 2736

LetsGetReal wrote: toddytodd wrote: LetsGetReal wrote: For time Travel to occur backwards that would mean that in fact time is just a re-run would it not? Thats what I've always thought is the fundament flaw in time travel backwards and sorta forwards. And would you be a copy of yourself or your legitamate self, because in essence if you are rewinding time would you also rewind what you had done or what had occured prior to the time you came from?

Some people believe that time travel isn't actually traveling back in time, but to other 'dimensions' which are on a different time line. How? Haven't a clue. :?
In an infinite universe, I suppose anything is possible though. I think thats fancy words to make something sound plausible when its not, but physics wasn't my subject because of concepts like this... I don't like dealing in an imaginary world but the real one..

Fancy words...maybe. Not plausible...maybe. Physics was my subject, but I never got into the whole time travel thing myself. Very interesting possibilities though, even if I can't understand it :lol:

issaiah1332 · Joined: 29 Jun 2006 Posts: 465 Location: Wv

LetsGetReal wrote: For time Travel to occur backwards that would mean that in fact time is just a re-run would it not? Thats what I've always thought is the fundament flaw in time travel backwards and sorta forwards. And would you be a copy of yourself or your legitamate self, because in essence if you are rewinding time would you also rewind what you had done or what had occured prior to the time you came from?

Well, (I do think time travel is possible) for time travel to work at all parallel universes must be incorporated into the equation. Therefore there could be infinite amounts of you and therefore time travel in the past is merely a odyssey into another dimension.

toddytodd · Joined: 20 May 2006 Posts: 2736

issaiah1332 wrote: LetsGetReal wrote: For time Travel to occur backwards that would mean that in fact time is just a re-run would it not? Thats what I've always thought is the fundament flaw in time travel backwards and sorta forwards. And would you be a copy of yourself or your legitamate self, because in essence if you are rewinding time would you also rewind what you had done or what had occured prior to the time you came from?

Well, (I do think time travel is possible) for time travel to work at all parallel universes must be incorporated into the equation. Therefore there could be infinite amounts of you and therefore time travel in the past is merely a odyssey into another dimension.

Maybe that is how or why some people get dejavoux (<-sp?). I get it all the time. Some times, it is so detailed, that I can tell you what will happen in the next 20-30 seconds.

Hyde · Posted: Sun Jul 09, 2006 11:59 pm Post subject:

toddytodd wrote: issaiah1332 wrote: LetsGetReal wrote: For time Travel to occur backwards that would mean that in fact time is just a re-run would it not? Thats what I've always thought is the fundament flaw in time travel backwards and sorta forwards. And would you be a copy of yourself or your legitamate self, because in essence if you are rewinding time would you also rewind what you had done or what had occured prior to the time you came from?

Well, (I do think time travel is possible) for time travel to work at all parallel universes must be incorporated into the equation. Therefore there could be infinite amounts of you and therefore time travel in the past is merely a odyssey into another dimension.

Maybe that is how or why some people get dejavoux (<-sp?). I get it all the time. Some times, it is so detailed, that I can tell you what will happen in the next 20-30 seconds.

this is no lie, i get dreams, just short like 30-40 second "clips" of things that will happen in the next day or two. its really weird.