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connermt
Joined: 27 Feb 2006
Posts: 1526
Location: CMH OHIO
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| Posted: Mon Apr 24, 2006 1:35 pm Post subject: Magic vs Miracles |
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What's the difference?
It seems to me that the difference is perception. If something supernatural happens that one can't attribute to God, then it's magic. If it is something that they can attribute to God, then it is a miracle.
What's the difference? |
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feederband
Joined: 26 Jan 2006
Posts: 3938
Location: Florida
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| Posted: Mon Apr 24, 2006 1:50 pm Post subject: Re: Magic vs Miracles |
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connermt wrote: What's the difference?
It seems to me that the difference is perception. If something supernatural happens that one can't attribute to God, then it's magic. If it is something that they can attribute to God, then it is a miracle.
What's the difference?
There are no miracles... Can anyone tell me of a miracle.... |
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Clara Listensprechen
Joined: 19 Apr 2006
Posts: 332
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| Posted: Mon Apr 24, 2006 2:27 pm Post subject: |
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There are miraculous claims like what's put Mother Theresa and the last Pope on a fast-track to sainthood.
A lot of people claim that the cheese sandwich with an apparent face on it was a miracle cuz it didn't turn mouldy (as if any kind of dried item would). The sandwich was sold to a gambling hall for luck.
Other things that don't have a kleenex worth of difference between 'em is religion and superstition. |
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connermt
Joined: 27 Feb 2006
Posts: 1526
Location: CMH OHIO
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| Posted: Mon Apr 24, 2006 9:42 pm Post subject: |
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Hmph...so I guess there is no difference?
Interesting.... |
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feederband
Joined: 26 Jan 2006
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Location: Florida
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| Posted: Mon Apr 24, 2006 11:14 pm Post subject: |
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connermt wrote: Hmph...so I guess there is no difference?
Interesting....
:lol: |
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Clara Listensprechen
Joined: 19 Apr 2006
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| Posted: Mon Apr 24, 2006 11:36 pm Post subject: |
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| I'll buy that. |
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eynon
Joined: 03 Jul 2004
Posts: 18639
Location: Minneapolis......
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| Posted: Tue Apr 25, 2006 12:55 am Post subject: |
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| I had God zap a migrane for me once....haven't gotten one since... :-D |
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feederband
Joined: 26 Jan 2006
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Location: Florida
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| Posted: Tue Apr 25, 2006 8:16 am Post subject: |
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Eynon81 wrote: I had God zap a migrane for me once....haven't gotten one since... :-D
OMG FINALLY A MIRACLE.... :lol: |
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fourtysixandtwo
Joined: 18 Feb 2005
Posts: 1012
Location: Mattawan, Michigan
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| Posted: Tue Apr 25, 2006 10:43 am Post subject: |
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mir·a·cle Audio pronunciation of "miracle" ( P ) Pronunciation Key (mr-kl)
n.
1. An event that appears inexplicable by the laws of nature and so is held to be supernatural in origin or an act of God: “Miracles are spontaneous, they cannot be summoned, but come of themselves" (Katherine Anne Porter).
2. One that excites admiring awe. See Synonyms at wonder.
3. A miracle play.
http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=miracle
mag·ic Audio pronunciation of "magic" ( P ) Pronunciation Key (mjk)
n.
1. The art that purports to control or forecast natural events, effects, or forces by invoking the supernatural.
2.
1. The practice of using charms, spells, or rituals to attempt to produce supernatural effects or control events in nature.
2. The charms, spells, and rituals so used.
3. The exercise of sleight of hand or conjuring for entertainment.
4. A mysterious quality of enchantment: “For me the names of those men breathed the magic of the past" (Max Beerbohm).
http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=magic
Very similar it would seem. |
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fourtysixandtwo
Joined: 18 Feb 2005
Posts: 1012
Location: Mattawan, Michigan
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| Posted: Tue Apr 25, 2006 10:44 am Post subject: |
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My bad, this definition of magic is more relative to the point.
1. Of, relating to, or invoking the supernatural: “stubborn unlaid ghost/That breaks his magic chains at curfew time” (John Milton).
2. Possessing distinctive qualities that produce unaccountable or baffling effects. |
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Enoch
Joined: 29 Aug 2005
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| Posted: Tue Apr 25, 2006 10:47 am Post subject: |
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| I agree that to deem something as Magick or a Miracle is purely based on perspective. The same event could be described as both, based on one's beliefs. |
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connermt
Joined: 27 Feb 2006
Posts: 1526
Location: CMH OHIO
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| Posted: Tue Apr 25, 2006 10:47 am Post subject: |
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fourtysixandtwo wrote: mir·a·cle Audio pronunciation of "miracle" ( P ) Pronunciation Key (mr-kl)
n.
1. An event that appears inexplicable by the laws of nature and so is held to be supernatural in origin or an act of God: “Miracles are spontaneous, they cannot be summoned, but come of themselves" (Katherine Anne Porter).
2. One that excites admiring awe. See Synonyms at wonder.
3. A miracle play.
http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=miracle
mag·ic Audio pronunciation of "magic" ( P ) Pronunciation Key (mjk)
n.
1. The art that purports to control or forecast natural events, effects, or forces by invoking the supernatural.
2.
1. The practice of using charms, spells, or rituals to attempt to produce supernatural effects or control events in nature.
2. The charms, spells, and rituals so used.
3. The exercise of sleight of hand or conjuring for entertainment.
4. A mysterious quality of enchantment: “For me the names of those men breathed the magic of the past" (Max Beerbohm).
http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=magic
Very similar it would seem.
So
Can't some miracles & some magic be interchangable? Or does it boil down to who does the miracle/magic trick? |
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Clara Listensprechen
Joined: 19 Apr 2006
Posts: 332
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| Posted: Tue Apr 25, 2006 12:33 pm Post subject: |
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UrielsFyre wrote: I agree that to deem something as Magick or a Miracle is purely based on perspective. The same event could be described as both, based on one's beliefs.
Glad to hear it. Either you know the recipe of how to bring either about or you don't,, and they're both dependent on recipes. Those who don't are the ones who are mystified enough to call either one a miracle or magic. Technology of the recipe is what it all invariably boils down to. |
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connermt
Joined: 27 Feb 2006
Posts: 1526
Location: CMH OHIO
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| Posted: Tue Apr 25, 2006 1:16 pm Post subject: |
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UrielsFyre wrote: I agree that to deem something as Magick or a Miracle is purely based on perspective. The same event could be described as both, based on one's beliefs.
I agree.
But some people see Jesus' miracles as MIRACLES & that's acceptable, but then see other things as MAGIC, which isn't acceptable.
It appears that the only variable between the two is the person doing the act. So is that what makes a miracle a miracle & a magic trick a trick? |
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fourtysixandtwo
Joined: 18 Feb 2005
Posts: 1012
Location: Mattawan, Michigan
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| Posted: Wed Apr 26, 2006 10:13 am Post subject: |
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I think the intent/result and the way they go about doing it resovles its definition.
The word "magic" takes the place of "miracle" typically when it isnt explained and has a strange/bad result. |
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soldierofchrist
Joined: 23 Apr 2006
Posts: 935
Location: Saint Marys, Georgia
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| Posted: Wed Apr 26, 2006 10:33 pm Post subject: |
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UrielsFyre wrote: I agree that to deem something as Magick or a Miracle is purely based on perspective. The same event could be described as both, based on one's beliefs.
Word. |
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eynon
Joined: 03 Jul 2004
Posts: 18639
Location: Minneapolis......
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| Posted: Wed Apr 26, 2006 10:51 pm Post subject: |
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feederband wrote: Eynon81 wrote: I had God zap a migrane for me once....haven't gotten one since... :-D
OMG FINALLY A MIRACLE.... :lol:
was for me :hy: |
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feederband
Joined: 26 Jan 2006
Posts: 3938
Location: Florida
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| Posted: Wed Apr 26, 2006 11:12 pm Post subject: |
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Eynon81 wrote: feederband wrote: Eynon81 wrote: I had God zap a migrane for me once....haven't gotten one since... :-D
OMG FINALLY A MIRACLE.... :lol:
was for me :hy:
:lol: |
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Gilbert1908
Joined: 26 Jan 2005
Posts: 5148
Location: Boston, MA
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| Posted: Thu Apr 27, 2006 10:41 am Post subject: |
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I think the fairer phrasing of the question would be, Do you believe in supernatural occurrance or not?
Since this phrasing does not really alienate or equate card tricks I do very well with inexplicable events that seem to be free of human causation and manipulation.
For those who do believe in supernatural occurances then miracles belong in a subset of those who happen to ascribe them to the First Cause or God, while others may have a different source. |
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connermt
Joined: 27 Feb 2006
Posts: 1526
Location: CMH OHIO
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| Posted: Thu Apr 27, 2006 12:26 pm Post subject: |
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Gilbert1908 wrote: I think the fairer phrasing of the question would be, Do you believe in supernatural occurrance or not?
Since this phrasing does not really alienate or equate card tricks I do very well with inexplicable events that seem to be free of human causation and manipulation.
For those who do believe in supernatural occurances then miracles belong in a subset of those who happen to ascribe them to the First Cause or God, while others may have a different source.
I can see what you are saying. But the question doesn't have to be fair. The reason why I asked the question was because when something happens that's 'good' & show no evidence of human interation, it is called a miracle. WHen something 'good' happen where there SEEMS to be human intervention, it is called magic. Now then, many christian say magic is 'of the Devil'....(etc etc etc), but miracles are ok. Are not miracles 'God's magic'? Why or why not? |
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