Political Crossfire Forums

[forthegreatergood]

Do you think it is GOOD or evil that the catholic church has made dogma that reincarnation is not true? Do you think reincarnation is real or not? Think about how trees regenerate and refresh, and things of that nature? Thoughts, comments, opinions?

[SilveryMinnow]

A good question. Regarding the fact that we are souls in heaven which are our true selves. We spend an amount of time on earth in the flesh, and return to heaven where our soul is represented in a different form.

I dont think this is recarnation though... resurrection?

[cap'n queasy]

Re-incarnation isn't part of Christian theology.

[SilveryMinnow]

No it isnt. Im not sure what is meant...

[Gilbert1908]

forthegreatergood wrote: Do you think it is GOOD or evil that the catholic church has made dogma that reincarnation is not true? Do you think reincarnation is real or not? Think about how trees regenerate and refresh, and things of that nature? Thoughts, comments, opinions?

No more than it is good or evil that Buddhists believe it to be true.

One can not practice Catholicism and believe in reincarnation, just as one can not practice Judaism and believe Jesus is the living God.

I fail to see the relevance of Catholicism in this question, unless of course it is a "Catholicism is the root of all intolerance and evil" threads?

[cap'n queasy]

Messianic Jews practice Judaism and they believe Y'shua was the Messiah. The incarnation of YHWH. Judaism is simply following the Torah Law.

Actually, you cannot practice actual, true Judaism without this belief in the true Moshiach. Which is why Y'shua called the the Pharisees the synagogue of Satan, those who call themselves Jews and are not. To truly follow Torah Law you must follow the teachings of Y'shua becase then you will worship YHWH in both truth and spirit. These teachings encompass the Law and the Prophets in a much more profound way than Pharisaical Judaism can.

These folks waited for Y'shua HaMeshiach for millennia. But when He came they had forgotten what they were waiting for.

[Todd D.]

I believe that "Messianic Judaism" is considered more a sect of Christianity than a sect of Judaism, at least by Jews. Not really relevant, that's just been my experience from the Jews that I have known. That's irrelevant, though, Gilbert's point could have just as easily said "One can not practice Islam and believe in Vishnu". The point is that the doctrines of the faith are irreconciable with certain concepts.

It also depends on how you define "Reincarnation". Christians DO believe in a certain form of Reincarnation, though we generally more associate it with Ressurrection. The concept of life after death and our spirits going to be with God does fit a certain mold of Reincarnation, but certainly not in the way that it means in the Hindu sense.

Like the others, I'm a little concerned that Catholicism was specifically endicted in this thread, since as far as I know, our theology over the resurrection of the body is not a point of contention between any of the Christian sects.

[perdidochas]

forthegreatergood wrote: Do you think it is GOOD or evil that the catholic church has made dogma that reincarnation is not true? Do you think reincarnation is real or not? Think about how trees regenerate and refresh, and things of that nature? Thoughts, comments, opinions?

Reincarnation cannot fit in with Christianity. I don't see how it fits Christian theology in the least.

[mattwa33193]

Reincarnation is central to Christianity, as it is to all religions (if you don't count Atheism as a religion). As someone else pointed out it isn't the same as Hindu reincarnation, but it's definitely there. It isn't dogma - life beyond death is the foundation of the church, since the goal of it's practitioners is to acheive it.

All dogma is evil.

[psholtz]

perdidochas wrote: forthegreatergood wrote: Do you think it is GOOD or evil that the catholic church has made dogma that reincarnation is not true? Do you think reincarnation is real or not? Think about how trees regenerate and refresh, and things of that nature? Thoughts, comments, opinions?

Reincarnation cannot fit in with Christianity. I don't see how it fits Christian theology in the least.
Yes, as the previous poster cited, reincarnation is a central tenent of Christianity (as it is of all valid religions).

[Gilbert1908]

psholtz wrote: perdidochas wrote: forthegreatergood wrote: Do you think it is GOOD or evil that the catholic church has made dogma that reincarnation is not true? Do you think reincarnation is real or not? Think about how trees regenerate and refresh, and things of that nature? Thoughts, comments, opinions?

Reincarnation cannot fit in with Christianity. I don't see how it fits Christian theology in the least.
Yes, as the previous poster cited, reincarnation is a central tenent of Christianity (as it is of all valid religions).

The eternal existence of the individual soul is NOT reincarnation.

[connermt]

psholtz wrote: perdidochas wrote: forthegreatergood wrote: Do you think it is GOOD or evil that the catholic church has made dogma that reincarnation is not true? Do you think reincarnation is real or not? Think about how trees regenerate and refresh, and things of that nature? Thoughts, comments, opinions?

Reincarnation cannot fit in with Christianity. I don't see how it fits Christian theology in the least.
Yes, as the previous poster cited, reincarnation is a central tenent of Christianity (as it is of all valid religions).

How do you see that?
Please explain

[perdidochas]

mattwa33193 wrote: Reincarnation is central to Christianity, as it is to all religions (if you don't count Atheism as a religion). As someone else pointed out it isn't the same as Hindu reincarnation, but it's definitely there. It isn't dogma - life beyond death is the foundation of the church, since the goal of it's practitioners is to acheive it.

All dogma is evil.

Christians believe in resurrection, which is coming back in the SAME body, and in everlasting life. Reincarnation is coming back as a DIFFERENT body. It is different.

[psholtz]

connermt wrote: psholtz wrote: perdidochas wrote: forthegreatergood wrote: Do you think it is GOOD or evil that the catholic church has made dogma that reincarnation is not true? Do you think reincarnation is real or not? Think about how trees regenerate and refresh, and things of that nature? Thoughts, comments, opinions?

Reincarnation cannot fit in with Christianity. I don't see how it fits Christian theology in the least.
Yes, as the previous poster cited, reincarnation is a central tenent of Christianity (as it is of all valid religions).

How do you see that?
Please explain
Malachi 4:5 and Matthew 11:14 are a good place to get started.

It's *extremely* difficult to interpret these verses (esp in combination w/ one another) as anything other than a statement on the fact of reincarnation, although I've seen fundamentalists jump through hoops to try to deny this.

There are many other references to re-incarnation in the NT..

[mattwa33193]

perdidochas wrote: mattwa33193 wrote: Reincarnation is central to Christianity, as it is to all religions (if you don't count Atheism as a religion). As someone else pointed out it isn't the same as Hindu reincarnation, but it's definitely there. It isn't dogma - life beyond death is the foundation of the church, since the goal of it's practitioners is to acheive it.

All dogma is evil.

Christians believe in resurrection, which is coming back in the SAME body, and in everlasting life. Reincarnation is coming back as a DIFFERENT body. It is different.

It's semantics. Both involve the same soul (or spirit) continuing on after their current physical body has perished.

[connermt]

psholtz wrote: connermt wrote: psholtz wrote: perdidochas wrote: forthegreatergood wrote: Do you think it is GOOD or evil that the catholic church has made dogma that reincarnation is not true? Do you think reincarnation is real or not? Think about how trees regenerate and refresh, and things of that nature? Thoughts, comments, opinions?

Reincarnation cannot fit in with Christianity. I don't see how it fits Christian theology in the least.
Yes, as the previous poster cited, reincarnation is a central tenent of Christianity (as it is of all valid religions).

How do you see that?
Please explain
Malachi 4:5 and Matthew 11:14 are a good place to get started.

It's *extremely* difficult to interpret these verses (esp in combination w/ one another) as anything other than a statement on the fact of reincarnation, although I've seen fundamentalists jump through hoops to try to deny this.

There are many other references to re-incarnation in the NT..
Hm..Matt 11:14 seems to me to compare someone to someone else (Elijah)

[cap'n queasy]

forthegreatergood wrote: Do you think it is GOOD or evil that the catholic church has made dogma that reincarnation is not true? Do you think reincarnation is real or not? Think about how trees regenerate and refresh, and things of that nature? Thoughts, comments, opinions?

What do you mean, how "trees regenerate and refresh"? And what, exactly, does that have to do with reincarnation?

[cap'n queasy]

mattwa33193 wrote: perdidochas wrote: mattwa33193 wrote: Reincarnation is central to Christianity, as it is to all religions (if you don't count Atheism as a religion). As someone else pointed out it isn't the same as Hindu reincarnation, but it's definitely there. It isn't dogma - life beyond death is the foundation of the church, since the goal of it's practitioners is to acheive it.

All dogma is evil.

Christians believe in resurrection, which is coming back in the SAME body, and in everlasting life. Reincarnation is coming back as a DIFFERENT body. It is different.

It's semantics. Both involve the same soul (or spirit) continuing on after their current physical body has perished.

Reincarnation involves being reborn into another physical body. And to continue to do so. Life after life until sufficient karma is built up to achieve nirvana and then your individuality ceases. So it is more a lengthy form of "self" annihilation rather than eternal life in an imperishable body, which is the Christian belief.

It's not semantics at all, unless you care nothing for precision in your thinking.

[cap'n queasy]

connermt wrote: psholtz wrote: connermt wrote: psholtz wrote: perdidochas wrote: forthegreatergood wrote: Do you think it is GOOD or evil that the catholic church has made dogma that reincarnation is not true? Do you think reincarnation is real or not? Think about how trees regenerate and refresh, and things of that nature? Thoughts, comments, opinions?

Reincarnation cannot fit in with Christianity. I don't see how it fits Christian theology in the least.
Yes, as the previous poster cited, reincarnation is a central tenent of Christianity (as it is of all valid religions).

How do you see that?
Please explain
Malachi 4:5 and Matthew 11:14 are a good place to get started.

It's *extremely* difficult to interpret these verses (esp in combination w/ one another) as anything other than a statement on the fact of reincarnation, although I've seen fundamentalists jump through hoops to try to deny this.

There are many other references to re-incarnation in the NT..
Hm..Matt 11:14 seems to me to compare someone to someone else (Elijah)

Conner, take a look at John 1:21 before you take these verses out of context and give them a meaning that they were not meant to have. It goes much deeper than a simplistic belief in reincarnation. This subject contains some very deep spiritual truths that you are going to miss looking at them like that.

Don't make my word for it, look and think about it for yourself, also don't take anyone else's word for what it means.

[mattwa33193]

You are focusing on details rather than the underlying principle. All major religions promise life after death, the carrot to the stick of a life of sacrifice. Catholics and Hindus agree that there is something for them beyond this life. They disagree on the nature of what awaits them.