Political Crossfire Forums

thintheherd · Posted: Tue Mar 28, 2006 12:00 pm Post subject:

Reason wrote: Quote: 1) I do love deer and ducks. I would rather they get killed humanely by a hunter, than die of starvation or by being hit by a car. I know of few hunters who do not truly love wildlife and nature. If you don't love wildlife and nature, you don't hunt, you stay inside and play videogames or watch football.

Awesome post. Human's are natural preators, and acting like one obviously isn't some crime against nature. The ties between the land and the frequent hunters I know are far stronger than that between the urbanite weekend eco-warriors I also know.
As a hunter, I can tell you first hand how true that is.

Winchester · Joined: 23 Aug 2005 Posts: 7816 Location: Montana

Reason wrote: Quote: 1) I do love deer and ducks. I would rather they get killed humanely by a hunter, than die of starvation or by being hit by a car. I know of few hunters who do not truly love wildlife and nature. If you don't love wildlife and nature, you don't hunt, you stay inside and play videogames or watch football.

Awesome post. Human's are natural preators, and acting like one obviously isn't some crime against nature. The ties between the land and the frequent hunters I know are far stronger than that between the urbanite weekend eco-warriors I also know.

Exactly.

Also, predators/omnivores have both eyes facing forward as this is necessary to be more effective hunters, natural selection at work. I'm sorry if this offends some of the more sensitive ones here, but I get a natural high when sneaking up on prey, the closer I get, the more excited I get. Again I also think this is natural selection and common in predators. I've observed my cat stalking birds, the cat shivers with anticipation. I have no problem with humans who want to deny their natural heritage, their choice and I don't really care, but you'll never stop me nor convince me it's wrong to hunt.

perdidochas · Joined: 06 Mar 2006 Posts: 15424 Location: Florida

Winchester wrote: Reason wrote: Quote: 1) I do love deer and ducks. I would rather they get killed humanely by a hunter, than die of starvation or by being hit by a car. I know of few hunters who do not truly love wildlife and nature. If you don't love wildlife and nature, you don't hunt, you stay inside and play videogames or watch football.

Awesome post. Human's are natural preators, and acting like one obviously isn't some crime against nature. The ties between the land and the frequent hunters I know are far stronger than that between the urbanite weekend eco-warriors I also know.

Exactly.

Also, predators/omnivores have both eyes facing forward as this is necessary to be more effective hunters, natural selection at work. I'm sorry if this offends some of the more sensitive ones here, but I get a natural high when sneaking up on prey, the closer I get, the more excited I get. Again I also think this is natural selection and common in predators. I've observed my cat stalking birds, the cat shivers with anticipation. I have no problem with humans who want to deny their natural heritage, their choice and I don't really care, but you'll never stop me nor convince me it's wrong to hunt.

I had a friend that was a semi-vegan animal rights person. He wouldn't eat dairy or eggs, or any farm-raised meat. He would only eat meat that had been caught from the wild. His reasoning was that wild meat (including fish) had been allowed to live most of it's life free, and that by killing and eating it, he was just fulfilling the function of predator in the ecosystem.

George W Bush · Posted: Tue Mar 28, 2006 1:26 pm Post subject:

biggest misconception: ALL PETA MEMBERS ARE EXTREMISTS.

This satisfies some aggressive-tendency niche in the extremist anti-peta philosophy.

An issue to 'pick on'.

Despite the lack of overwhelming evidence that Pamela Anderson and folks, do drive by paint-drenching of fur wearers, the anti's have concluded that all are responsible whom associate with this PETA.

Just like in religion, you will get extremists. Islam, Christianity, whatever. In fact, in religion you will get killers and murderers.

I say: GET A GRIP. Had they adopted the accused tendencies across-the-board, there would be no PETA and your opinions would be validated.

You just want to whine about an issue. It does something for you to blackball PETA. I dont know what. Perhaps, it increases your testosterone leve? Or gives a nice release?

But, whatever. PETAs great. They love animals. and thats all they need to do to get my support.

thintheherd · Posted: Tue Mar 28, 2006 1:39 pm Post subject:

George W Bush wrote: biggest misconception: ALL PETA MEMBERS ARE EXTREMISTS.

This satisfies some aggressive-tendency niche in the extremist anti-peta philosophy.

An issue to 'pick on'.

Despite the lack of overwhelming evidence that Pamela Anderson and folks, do drive by paint-drenching of fur wearers, the anti's have concluded that all are responsible whom associate with this PETA.

Just like in religion, you will get extremists. Islam, Christianity, whatever. In fact, in religion you will get killers and murderers.

I say: GET A GRIP. Had they adopted the accused tendencies across-the-board, there would be no PETA and your opinions would be validated.

You just want to whine about an issue. It does something for you to blackball PETA. I dont know what. Perhaps, it increases your testosterone leve? Or gives a nice release?

But, whatever. PETAs great. They love animals. and thats all they need to do to get my support.
1) There is such a thing as guilt by association.

2) The 'great ones' you align yourself with kill animals too you know.

3) Attacking your opponents in a debate signals intellectual bankruptcy in the argument and damages your credibility for future debates.

Finally, we didn't bring up the issue... you did.

perdidochas · Joined: 06 Mar 2006 Posts: 15424 Location: Florida

George W Bush wrote: biggest misconception: ALL PETA MEMBERS ARE EXTREMISTS.

This satisfies some aggressive-tendency niche in the extremist anti-peta philosophy.

An issue to 'pick on'.

Despite the lack of overwhelming evidence that Pamela Anderson and folks, do drive by paint-drenching of fur wearers, the anti's have concluded that all are responsible whom associate with this PETA.

Just like in religion, you will get extremists. Islam, Christianity, whatever. In fact, in religion you will get killers and murderers.

I say: GET A GRIP. Had they adopted the accused tendencies across-the-board, there would be no PETA and your opinions would be validated.

You just want to whine about an issue. It does something for you to blackball PETA. I dont know what. Perhaps, it increases your testosterone leve? Or gives a nice release?

But, whatever. PETAs great. They love animals. and thats all they need to do to get my support.

While I don't blame PETA for all the cranks and weirdos in it, you cannot disavow nutcases like Pamela Anderson who are spokespersons for PETA. The spokespeople are representative of the group, or what the group wants represented.

thintheherd · Posted: Tue Mar 28, 2006 1:51 pm Post subject:

PeTA's Death Toll:

http://www.petakillsanimals.com/downloads/PetaKillsAnimals.pdf

Wolverine · Joined: 15 Jul 2005 Posts: 11171 Location: Podunk, Colorado

George W Bush wrote: biggest misconception: ALL PETA MEMBERS ARE EXTREMISTS.

This satisfies some aggressive-tendency niche in the extremist anti-peta philosophy.

An issue to 'pick on'.
No hunting.
No butchering.
No cheap milk.
No cheap eggs.
No animal testing.

How is that not extreme?

Quote: Despite the lack of overwhelming evidence that Pamela Anderson and folks, do drive by paint-drenching of fur wearers, the anti's have concluded that all are responsible whom associate with this PETA.
PETA encourages it. Wow, PETA encourages the destruction of private property.
http://www.peta.org/feat/petatomato/
Of course they forget that if a person has the money to buy a fur coat, they will buy another one, thus killing more Bambie's.

Robin Hood · Joined: 14 Sep 2005 Posts: 3295

Quote: But, whatever. PETAs great. They love animals. and thats all they need to do to get my support.

Kind of reminds me of the South Park 'Vote or die' episode, but perhaps I'm being unfair. Will you support anyone who loves animals?

Sataere · Joined: 27 Jan 2006 Posts: 226 Location: Ohio

George W Bush wrote: Wolverine wrote: Didn't they kill a bunch of animsl themselvs? Don't they also destroy property when they toss dye on fur coats?

no. and no.

Yeah it wasn't dye. It was animal blood they tossed on the fur coats...

TNBiologist · Joined: 31 Jan 2006 Posts: 962 Location: Tennessee

Article in the Richmoand Times about the PETA backlash and the 2 PETA personnel acused of 22 counts of felony animal cruelty.

http://www.timesdispatch.com/servlet/Satellite?pagename=RTD%2FMGArticle%2FRTD_BasicArticle&c=MGArticle&cid=1137835009949&path=%21news&s=1045855934842

Swandazi · Joined: 31 Mar 2006 Posts: 268

If peta got its way we'd all be grass munching hippys. They oppose hunting which is "REQUIRED" in most cases to keep a population of animals from starving. Which means they approve the slow death of starvation over the quick death from a bullet for these animals. They oppose fishing when if they cared about salmon or any river fish they should be yelling at the damns (which power their houses) for not having fish ladders and chopping up the salmon.

Conclusion: Peta is probably the most hypocritical do as i say not as i do group in the world...

Swandazi

Canadian_Patriot · Joined: 14 Feb 2006 Posts: 323

I'm a hippy and don't eat twigs or grass. I throw the twigs out and smoke the grass. :lol:

Yeah PETA members are extreme and i will say on the record that if any skinny lookin person spray paint my jacket for being leather i will kick their ass.

I do not condone violence i will respond violently to violence however because throwing stuff and paint at people is wrong no matter what they wear. If they don't like it they don't have to wear it or eat it. After the FBI disband PETA and throw BBQ herself Newkirk in jail for fraud, terrorism and extortion then the panty waste members can go home and cry to mommy or to jail depending on who you are.

Greenpeace is just as bad as PETA and all these groups all share one common thing extremism. Extremism is not terrorism though however anyone willing to blow up a building to set animals free or spray paint someone red is guilty of both.

f**k you PETA

George W Bush · Posted: Sat Apr 01, 2006 10:41 pm Post subject:

the point is: YOU ARE WRONG - to accuse people of doing a crime they did not commit.

the guilt by association argument is merely SOCIAL. that is, there is no substance when standing up to the discrepencies of, for example, the justice system. IN OTHER WORDS, go ahead and SUE ME because of something some PETA member did - all because your incorrect observation of my activity correlates with theirs? I guess I will see you in court. I will win, of course. But based on the magnitude of your overzealous observation, I should get ready for court.

The caring PETA members outnumber the ones seeking fame. I am saying the extremists do not speak for the cause. And the cause is whats important.

thintheherd · Posted: Sat Apr 01, 2006 10:57 pm Post subject:

So... according to your logic, if one claims they like, and associate themselves with, say... Nazi's simply because 'one of the things they support is the free use of the swastika'. In your eyes they're okee dokee so long as you dismiss all of the hypocrisy and other bad things they stand for, or do for that matter?

Yeah... ok. You've convinced me... :roll:

Wolverine · Joined: 15 Jul 2005 Posts: 11171 Location: Podunk, Colorado

I think I will start worshipping Stalin, but I will ignore the millions he killed.

Oh well.

Quote: "From July 1998 through the end of 2004, PETA killed over 12,400 dogs, cats, and other 'companion animals' at its Norfolk, Virginia headquarters," the site notes.

http://www.timesdispatch.com/servlet/Satellite?pagename=RTD%2FMGArticle%2FRTD_BasicArticle&c=MGArticle&cid=1137835009949&path=%21news&s=1045855934842

George W Bush · Posted: Mon Apr 03, 2006 1:27 pm Post subject:

thintheherd wrote: So... according to your logic, if one claims they like, and associate themselves with, say... Nazi's simply because 'one of the things they support is the free use of the swastika'. In your eyes they're okee dokee so long as you dismiss all of the hypocrisy and other bad things they stand for, or do for that matter?

Yeah... ok. You've convinced me... :roll:

Take a logic class or something.

I cant help you see the point.

You are so deluded with your own sense of blackballing ambition, youve extended your base of assertion to include Nazi's. Grow the hell up and ADMIT you are wrong.

Btw, Nazi's have a pretty focused objective unlike your ignorant observation of PETA . Whereas Nazi's believe in Aryans the supreme race and everything else eliminated (as far as I know), PETA does not have an express policy of extremism as you and other spitters on here note.

I assume that you take things like tabloid newspapers seriously, or that there really WAS a bat baby. In other words, you are easily deluded to believe anything that stimulates your appetite for drama.

I conclude you are a DRAMA QUEEN.

That is not an insult, by the way. Just an observation.

Have a nice day, scarlet o'hara.

thintheherd · Posted: Mon Apr 03, 2006 2:31 pm Post subject:

George W Bush wrote: thintheherd wrote: So... according to your logic, if one claims they like, and associate themselves with, say... Nazi's simply because 'one of the things they support is the free use of the swastika'. In your eyes they're okee dokee so long as you dismiss all of the hypocrisy and other bad things they stand for, or do for that matter?

Yeah... ok. You've convinced me... :roll:

Take a logic class or something.

I cant help you see the point.

You are so deluded with your own sense of blackballing ambition, youve extended your base of assertion to include Nazi's. Grow the hell up and ADMIT you are wrong.

Btw, Nazi's have a pretty focused objective unlike your ignorant observation of PETA . Whereas Nazi's believe in Aryans the supreme race and everything else eliminated (as far as I know), PETA does not have an express policy of extremism as you and other spitters on here note.

I assume that you take things like tabloid newspapers seriously, or that there really WAS a bat baby. In other words, you are easily deluded to believe anything that stimulates your appetite for drama.

I conclude you are a DRAMA QUEEN.

That is not an insult, by the way. Just an observation.

Have a nice day, scarlet o'hara.
Wrong?? Blackballing ambitions?? Tabloids?? Drama Queen? Not insults? :lol: :lol: :lol: But... I'm Red Butler!

[Back to the subject] No, they most certainly DO have focused, extremists position/agenda. It's a shame you cannot see that.

Look, I understand your position. I know it's tough trying to defend an organization you so want to believe is doing the right thing. The attempt to do so is somewhat admirable. I'm just here to help you understand that you don't need to align yourself with those types of eco-terrorists in order to love animals. And that the harvesting and use of the same are anything but indicators of animal hate.

You have to be a realist occasionally. You see, I hunt and eat meat because I love animals.

Now, if you'd like to have an intelligent conversation about how that can possibly be, cut the 'non-insults' and I'd be more than happy to explain.

r3awak3n · Joined: 02 Apr 2006 Posts: 4 Location: Savannah, GA

Peta can indeed be a little bit extremist and lots of times try to impose their views on others any way possible. There is a problem in the food industry, that is a fact, there are millions of animals being killed in a unhuman way, there is land in the rainforest being destroyed to raise cattle to be used in amiricans favorite fast foot restaurants, etc... this is the problem, not raising cattle humanly and killing it for food later on. PETA takes things to the extreme and wants everybody to be vegan, something that will never happen, they should be focusing more on problems that can be solved instead of utopic solutions. I have been vegetarian for 6 years and I say, if you want to be a vegetarian/vegan do so but dont force your opinions on others, you can try to teach them but not bombard them with your ideology. And I have heard and read about some misconducts by PETA so I am not going to defend it, it does have a few good causes that i support though.

Ah, for all the hunters, one thing is hunting for food, other is hunting for fun which is pretty damn immoral.

Swandazi · Joined: 31 Mar 2006 Posts: 268

Whats wrong with hunting for fun. I probly wouldnt want to hunt if it wasnt fun. I get some dang excited when i see a deer that my sights cant stay in the same spot and i usually end up missing the deer, but the deer are so dumb they usually run towards me and they get close enough so that even if my sights move a bit i can still hit em. But after i get it i use its fur , meat, and skull.

Swandazi