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John
Joined: 02 Jun 2004
Posts: 21268
Location: Jerez de la Frontera
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| Posted: Fri Mar 24, 2006 10:22 am Post subject: Pele-joez-el-gibbor-Abi-ad-sar-shalom |
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Isaiah 9 (NASB)
4 For You shall break the yoke of their burden and the staff on their shoulders,
The rod of their oppressor, as at the battle of Midian.
5 For every boot of the booted warrior in the battle tumult,
And cloak rolled in blood, will be for burning, fuel for the fire.
6 For a child will be born to us, a son will be given to us;
And the government will rest on His shoulders;
And His name will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God,
Eternal Father, Prince of Peace.
7 There will be no end to the increase of His government or of peace,
On the throne of David and over his kingdom,
To establish it and to uphold it with justice and righteousness
From then on and forevermore
The zeal of the LORD of hosts will accomplish this.
I guess my question is mainly about this section of text: For a child will be born to us, a son will be given to us;And the government will rest on His shoulders;And His name will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God,Eternal Father, Prince of Peace. View Hebrew w/translation here..
How does the typical religious Jew interpret this passage...and how does this apply to Messiah?
The reason I say Messiah is because of this part:
On the throne of David and over his kingdom.
What seems strange is that when I looked into what the Jewish TANAKH translation stated...it almost seems censored. This is what it reads...
For a child is born unto us, a son is given unto us; and the government is upon his shoulder; and his name is called Pele-joez-el-gibbor-Abi-ad-sar-shalom;
View JPS 1917 Translation here |
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Mailech
Joined: 31 Aug 2004
Posts: 2531
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| Posted: Mon Mar 27, 2006 8:42 am Post subject: Re: Pele-joez-el-gibbor-Abi-ad-sar-shalom |
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John wrote: Isaiah 9 (NASB)
4 For You shall break the yoke of their burden and the staff on their shoulders,
The rod of their oppressor, as at the battle of Midian.
5 For every boot of the booted warrior in the battle tumult,
And cloak rolled in blood, will be for burning, fuel for the fire.
6 For a child will be born to us, a son will be given to us;
And the government will rest on His shoulders;
And His name will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God,
Eternal Father, Prince of Peace.
7 There will be no end to the increase of His government or of peace,
On the throne of David and over his kingdom,
To establish it and to uphold it with justice and righteousness
From then on and forevermore
The zeal of the LORD of hosts will accomplish this.
I guess my question is mainly about this section of text: For a child will be born to us, a son will be given to us;And the government will rest on His shoulders;And His name will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God,Eternal Father, Prince of Peace. View Hebrew w/translation here..
How does the typical religious Jew interpret this passage...and how does this apply to Messiah?
The reason I say Messiah is because of this part:
On the throne of David and over his kingdom.
It is about the messiah, the messiah King Hezekiah. He was the one who was named Prince of Peace. Granted there are two interpretations that I have seen. One is
And Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God,Eternal Father shall call his name Prince of Peace.
The other one is that all of these phrases refer to Hezekiah. And it is not saying that he is G-d, Chas Veshalom. It is saying that He is mighty and has G-d's Might with him.
Quote: What seems strange is that when I looked into what the Jewish TANAKH translation stated...it almost seems censored. This is what it reads...
For a child is born unto us, a son is given unto us; and the government is upon his shoulder; and his name is called Pele-joez-el-gibbor-Abi-ad-sar-shalom;
View JPS 1917 Translation here
It is not a cover up or censored, don't be so quick to condemn us John. What does it say, it says that his name is all of the above. That means, that that is his name. This is consistent. If we translated every name. That Isaac would be written in the English Bible as 'Will Laugh' And so 'Will Laugh' went out to the field :lol:
Or Hezekiah would be translated as 'G-d strengthens'
From now on John, you may address me as 'My G-d is King'. We will call Jonah 'Dove'. If you have any friends named Michael, start calling then 'Who is like G-d'. Because if not then we are censoring. :wink: |
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