Political Crossfire Forums

arti · Joined: 08 Mar 2006 Posts: 2

Simply put, the purpose of existence is life. This is a difficult point to relate so bear with me.

A virtually infinite spectrum of possibility formed our universe. Had the Big Bang been a fraction of a degree different we would not be here. The fact that we are here means one of two things. Either we could argue that our universe is one of a virtually infinite number of “trials”. Like a giant crapshoot, we exist because of the pure luck of the draw. See enough poker hands and eventually you are going to hit a royal flush. Or as religion would have it, we exist because of a careful arrangement of interactions down to the subatomic level. In this case, we are here because a higher power, or what have you, wants us to be here.

Now I’m going to lead you through an argument. Let’s assume the purpose of existence is to reach some pinnacle of understanding. This means the entire reason this delicate balance we call life was constructed, the entire universe, is for enlightened thought to understand something. What happens when you understand that something? Do we simply fail to exist? Does the world end and humans advance into heaven? I do not claim to know the answers to these questions. I do, however, question the train of thought that brought them into the discussion. I do not think the entire universe with all of its majestic creation is simply to teach us a lesson.

Let’s assume we existed as all-knowing beings. If you know everything, what is the purpose of having thought? These beings would be in a steady state for their entire existence. There would be no conflict in their lives, nothing to anticipate or experience emotion over, no reason for time. This is the eternal waiting room. Heaven? Hell? Purgatory? Call it what you will, I would rather be an ant then exist as nothing.

What do humans do when they are bored? They attempt to entertain themselves. Why is prison such a common punishment? It attempts to bore prisoners into submission to society. We take people away from “life” and they get depressed. Entertainment is so popular because it creates variation and conflict in our lives. Isn’t it obvious? We are here to live life. We create conflict in our own lives to entertain us. The entire creation of this delicate universe is so you can experience love, joy, anger, fear, and all of the other complex emotions humans are capable of. I believe we created ourselves. We wanted to be entertained in the ultimate game, life.

So go on vacation, hit on the secretary, drive like a maniac, and steal a candy bar. You are alive. Create some conflict in your life.

-arti

station agent · Joined: 08 Mar 2006 Posts: 52

arti wrote: So go on vacation, hit on the secretary, drive like a maniac, and steal a candy bar. You are alive. Create some conflict in your life.

-arti

Well said. I just kidnapped a baby elephant from the zoo. It is so on!

The Ferryman · Joined: 19 Sep 2005 Posts: 1518

The purpose of existence is to atrophy.

BipolarExpress · Joined: 26 Feb 2006 Posts: 53 Location: Boston/Providence

[quote]What do humans do when they are bored? They attempt to entertain themselves. Why is prison such a common punishment? It attempts to bore prisoners into submission to society. We take people away from “life” and they get depressed. Entertainment is so popular because it creates variation and conflict in our lives. Isn’t it obvious? We are here to live life. We create conflict in our own lives to entertain us. The entire creation of this delicate universe is so you can experience love, joy, anger, fear, and all of the other complex emotions humans are capable of. I believe we created ourselves. We wanted to be entertained in the ultimate game, life. [/quote]

True. there is nothing to do in prison besides eat, sleep, think, do drugs, and socialize with other criminals. I do agree humans create a lot of the conflict, but the conflict is there from the start. Chaos and Order are both intricate pieces of the universe as are many opposites. The entire universe seems to be based around the idea of opposites. Two things that are similar but different. The electromagnetic force deals with positive and negatively charged particles. Magnets always have a south and a north pole. In fact all forces obey this same idea except gravity. Gravity is always attractive between any two objects with mass and has no opposite.

The main thing I want you to think about is the opposite of nothing. Everything. Nothing and Everything are complete opposites. Only these two don't cancel each other out. If the two opposites cancelled each other than they would have a sum of zero and thus the universe would not exists at all. If only Nothing exists and thus the idea of an opposite doesn't exists either than the universe would not be here.

The universe obviously is here so the answer must be one of the following: If you said both everything and nothing exist at the same time they would not cancel each other and thus something would exists. It would essentially be the same as if you said everything exists and there's no such thing as Nothing. That Nothing was just an abstract idea.

Since abstract ideas form the basis for mathematics which we use as a tool to describe the universe. It makes sense to say that the abstract idea of nothing and of the notion of an opposite would create a universe in itself. Everything can be created from nothing if you consider the possibility of an opposite. And that's all the universe really is, Infinite possibilities. An infinite number of things that could be one or the other of two opposites and how they build upon each other.

BipolarExpress · Joined: 26 Feb 2006 Posts: 53 Location: Boston/Providence

The purpose of existence is propagation and to take over the universe and rule it before hostile alien intelligence does. This will never happen until we can put our petty problems here on earth behind us and move to the heavens. We must then construct a battle station around our star and reproduce ourselves in such numbers we could never before imagine.

One and Only... · Joined: 19 Jan 2006 Posts: 85 Location: Winchester, VA

I am perfectly comfortable living without purpose.

BipolarExpress · Joined: 26 Feb 2006 Posts: 53 Location: Boston/Providence

Life really has whatever purpose you want it to have. You choose your own destiny and find your own purpose. If you choose to have no purpose than that is your choice. As far as I can tell, this world is real and I want to do things with my life and not waste it. But at the same time I realize that no matter what happens time will keep passing, and passing, and passing. The entire world as we know it will most likely someday be forgotten.

Cato · Joined: 28 Jul 2004 Posts: 1274 Location: Ottawa, ON

Quote: Simply put, the purpose of existence is life.

I don't know if you realize, but this is logically circular. 'Why existence? Existence,' is essentially what you're saying, which really isn't saying much. It's much like asking, 'why is the sky blue?' and being answered, 'because it's blue.'

As far as the question of 'purpose' is concerned, this is the very core of philosophical inquiry. It is exactly what we're all trying to find.

Quote: Let’s assume we existed as all-knowing beings. If you know everything, what is the purpose of having thought? These beings would be in a steady state for their entire existence. There would be no conflict in their lives, nothing to anticipate or experience emotion over, no reason for time. This is the eternal waiting room.

To take a cue from Aristotle, the purpose of 'thought' is to achieve the contemplative life, which is the most happy life. Since the most happy life is that lived in accordance with the highest good, and the highest good contains everything, for if it lacked any good it would fail to be the highest, to say that one would be bored in observance of it is absurd. Boredom, in the framework of Aristotelian philosophy, is the product of extensive leisure (a dangerous excess). Since contemplation is an activity, the highest activity in fact, boredom is a non-issue.

You see, the contemplative life is the end toward which we all naturally aim. To live it is to achieve the 'purpose' for thought, not to negate its purpose.

Biggity Boom-Boom · Joined: 28 Feb 2006 Posts: 446 Location: The Event Horizon

The purpose of Life?

Our perpetuation requires sexual union. Very kewl, yes?

So LoveUnion is our one definitive purpose.

The other is to feel an urgency that moves us ever upward towards a spiritual progress, and that progress is an understanding of the beauty of all creation through the kindness of ourselves and the dissemination of happiness through our love of that beauty.

Doowstados · Joined: 04 Nov 2005 Posts: 281

The purpose of life is impossible to comprehend, we should figure out how we got here 1st.

Robin Hood · Joined: 14 Sep 2005 Posts: 3295

Quote: The purpose of existence is propagation and to take over the universe and rule it before hostile alien intelligence does. This will never happen until we can put our petty problems here on earth behind us and move to the heavens. We must then construct a battle station around our star and reproduce ourselves in such numbers we could never before imagine.

Couldn't we just send them a strongly worded letter?

Doowstados · Joined: 04 Nov 2005 Posts: 281

Then why by chance are these "hostile alien races" here? To lose to us? that makes no sense...

Mr. Jaggers · Joined: 15 Mar 2006 Posts: 152

edited

Doowstados · Joined: 04 Nov 2005 Posts: 281

lol nice 1

MLBrandow · Joined: 14 Mar 2006 Posts: 105 Location: Tallahassee, FL

Cato wrote: Quote: Simply put, the purpose of existence is life.

I don't know if you realize, but this is logically circular. 'Why existence? Existence,' is essentially what you're saying, which really isn't saying much. It's much like asking, 'why is the sky blue?' and being answered, 'because it's blue.'

It is indeed circular reasoning, but that's exactly the point. Ever wonder why people go mad trying to define the purpose of life into concrete terms? You can't. You can't abstractly identify "62". It's a concrete value.

My opinions are probably slanted because I see little value in most philosophy, but I do believe he's hit the nail on the donkey's posterior in his first sentence.

The purpose of existance is life. The purpose of life is to live. We exist so that we may live.

I think more probably that the answer is just so simple that it shocks the conscience (irony in word choice) of philosophers. If the answer were indeed realized to be so simple, they would all have to get real jobs and be productive members of society.

Cato · Joined: 28 Jul 2004 Posts: 1274 Location: Ottawa, ON

Quote: It is indeed circular reasoning, but that's exactly the point. . . . The purpose of existance is life. The purpose of life is to live. We exist so that we may live.

My only problem is that you're not really answering the implied question... You're simply bypassing it. If you're not interested in the questions of philosophy, is this the place for you to be wasting your time?

Quote: Ever wonder why people go mad trying to define the purpose of life into concrete terms? You can't. You can't abstractly identify "62". It's a concrete value.

I don't consider existentialists mad per se (though, I'm one). I think that the problem is the question itself. If there is no metaphysical 'purpose', then the question aims to find the absurd. Really, you should be asking, 'is there a purpose to life?' before, 'what is the purpose of life?'

MLBrandow · Joined: 14 Mar 2006 Posts: 105 Location: Tallahassee, FL

Cato wrote: Quote: It is indeed circular reasoning, but that's exactly the point. . . . The purpose of existance is life. The purpose of life is to live. We exist so that we may live.

My only problem is that you're not really answering the implied question... You're simply bypassing it. If you're not interested in the questions of philosophy, is this the place for you to be wasting your time?

Quote: Ever wonder why people go mad trying to define the purpose of life into concrete terms? You can't. You can't abstractly identify "62". It's a concrete value.

I don't consider existentialists mad per se (though, I'm one). I think that the problem is the question itself. If there is no metaphysical 'purpose', then the question aims to find the absurd. Really, you should be asking, 'is there a purpose to life?' before, 'what is the purpose of life?'
We can argue this all day, but until you realize that you can't concretely identify an abstract ideology, we'll just continue to circumvent each other.

You correctly identify that the problem is in the question itself. You can't answer a circular question without equally circular reasoning. And there is a metaphysical purpose to life. But it can't be explained concretely. As you so eloquently put it, the would-be respondant aims to find the absurd.

I've always considered philosophy to be predominantly a little kids' game. For grown men to discuss such concepts on end and trying to debate things beyond communicable means, to delve into places where words alone are not sufficient, is to just be wishfully pretending to know of what is being discussed.

I think John Lennon best answered this question: Life is what happens while you are busy making other plans.

To define it more clearly is asking more than language alone can offer.

Now, while philosophers dally around attempting to think critically, others are actually critically thinking about tasks of merit.

Let's pretend some more:

Let's pretend that there is a definitive and clear answer to this ultimate question.

The purpose of life is to be a productive member of the society in which you live.

Just for pretend's sake, let's say that answers your question. Now what? Do you try to think up a new question that can't be answered? Do you start spending more time with your family? Watching football? Living life?

Men of philosophy find questions and try to understand them. Men of fact find questions and figure them out.

How can a philosopher figure out a question to which he himself does not understand? That he can ask it gives him credibility as a thinker?

Why is elephant conduit against blue?

Can you answer this question? Do you even understand it? Does that mean I've somehow outsmarted you and that I'm a great thinker?

Those who ask the great questions do so because they lack self-fulfillment and are constantly searching for a meaning to justify their existances which have no meaning.

If you want an answer, go out and find one. Go do something with your life. Don't sit at a desk and type into an internet forum and expect to google the purpose of life. Go play catch with your son, take your dog for a walk, go to law school. Find something that gives your life meaning. But don't just sit around asking abstract questions and expecting to find concrete all-encompassing answers. That is indeed absurd.

This is why there are no jobs for philosophers outside of educating more philosophers.

Cato · Joined: 28 Jul 2004 Posts: 1274 Location: Ottawa, ON

Quote: Why is elephant conduit against blue?

Can you answer this question? Do you even understand it? Does that mean I've somehow outsmarted you and that I'm a great thinker?

No, your question is logically nonsensical. You see, the question cannot be answered because the question itself makes no sense. This may be the case for our 'purpose' question as well. There may simply not be an eternal and innate 'purpose' to human life, and thus no answer to the question, making it an absurd question. Is that so hard to swallow?

MLBrandow · Joined: 14 Mar 2006 Posts: 105 Location: Tallahassee, FL

Cato wrote: Quote: Why is elephant conduit against blue?

Can you answer this question? Do you even understand it? Does that mean I've somehow outsmarted you and that I'm a great thinker?

No, your question is logically nonsensical. You see, the question cannot be answered because the question itself makes no sense. This may be the case for our 'purpose' question as well. There may simply not be an eternal and innate 'purpose' to human life, and thus no answer to the question, making it an absurd question. Is that so hard to swallow?

I'm with you on that. I don't understand why it's such a difficult concept to assimilate.

Some will try though....

Doowstados · Joined: 04 Nov 2005 Posts: 281

Once again, the answer is impossible. Just like God is impossible. Just like Evolutuion is impossible. Why? Because energy cannot be created nor destroyed. What created energy? What gave what created energy the energy to create energy? Think about this really hard and you will understand.