Political Crossfire Forums

A Promise Kept · Joined: 11 Apr 2006 Posts: 93

When do you think life begins? Women don't know for sure that they are pregnant until about five or six days before their missed period. That gives the embryo time to develop. A baby has a heartbeat after 6 weeks of pregnancy. An abortion can cost up to $700 and scheduling one takes at least a week or two, giving the baby more time to develop.
No I don't think women should be enslaved. I just think that people should take responsibility for their actions.

Oh and you don't think women are enslaved?...they aren't enslaved, but they are exploited and alienated with pressure to be "perfect" or hollywood material. The ideal woman these days to most people (not me) that women are supposed to be the man's b****, so they are pressured into sex by men most of the time, but everybody has had a health class or two in their lifetime and doesn't take a rocket scientist to know that you could very well get pregnant when having sex. So it is both the man and women's fault. If your not ready to take the responsibility of the possibilty of a child then you should not have sex. You can choose to but its a risk. There are so many people out there who can't have children who would love to have children, so if you just put the baby up for adoption then your blessing someone who is less fortunate then you.

Here are some facts

In a 2003 Gallup poll in the United States, 72% of respondents were in favor of spousal notification, with 26% opposed; of those polled, 79% of males and 67% of females responded in favor.

Personal accounts of Abortions

HI...

I WAS 17YRS OLD, WHEN I HAD MY ABORTION. I AM NOW 22 YEARS OLD AND TILL THIS DAY REGRET WHAT I DID. THEIR IS NOT A DAY THAT GOES BY THAT I DON'T TRY TO IMAGINE HOW MY BABY WOULD HAVE LOOKED LIKE. WOULD THE BABY HAD BEEN A GIRL OR BOY WOLD THE BABY LOOK LIKE ME OR LIKE THE DADDY.

YOU KNOW I WENT TO THE ABORTION CLINIC 2X BEFORE I COULD DO WHAT I DID. WHEN I FIRST WENT IN THE STAFF DID ALL THE EXAMS THAT THEY HAD TO DO BEFORE THE ABORTION AND THEN THEY SAT ME IN A WAITING ROOM FULL OF GIRLS, GIRLS WAITING FOR THE SAME THING I WAS WAITING FOR " THE ABORTION".

BUT THE ONLY DIFFERENCE BETWEEN ME AND THOSE OTHER GIRLS WAS THAT I DID NOT WANT THIS... I THOUGHT AT THE TIME THAT, THIS WAS MY ONLY OPTION AND IT WAS THIS OR NOTHING. THE OTHER GIRLS WERE HAPPY THEY WERE GETTING THE ABORTION THEY SPOKE ABOUT HOW THEY COULD NOT WAIT TO GET THE BABY OUT OF THEM SO THEY COULD GO BACK TO THEIR LIFE STYLES. I WAS THE ONLY ONE SITTING IN THE CORNER, CRYING. FINALLY I GOT UP AND RAN OUT OF THE ABORTION CLINIC.

BUT 2 DAYS LATTER I WENT BACK AND WENT THROUGH WITH IT. I DID NOT WANT TO DO IT BUT I HAD NO OTHER CHOICE IN MY MIND. I NEED THE GIRLS WHO READ THIS LIFE STORY TO KNOW EVERY ONE HAS ANOTHER CHOICE, EVERY ONE... DON'T SETTLE FOR THIS ONE. I WISH I COULD GO BACK AND CHANGE WHAT I DID BECAUSE THEN I WOULD HAVE MY BABY, MY FUTURE A PART OF ME.

I.

To whom it may concern:

I became pregnant for the first time at the age of 14. Being young I stupidly tried to will it away. By the time my mom found out I was almost five months. She took me to the doctor for the sole purpose of trying pressure me into scheduling an abortion. The doctor had said because so big the "procedure" would take 2 days but once I went through with day 1 it would be too late to change my mind. She used the word "baby" not "fetus". My mom told me to "sleep on it." The next morning I told my mom I couldn't go through with it and My daughter is now 6 years old. I'm not a religious person, I just thougt it seemed wrong, even though I didn't even know about abortion then, to be pregnant and then to do anything to end being pregnant felt unnatural to me. At the age of 16 I became pregnant again. Already knowing full well what I had gotten myself into I decided I should get and abortion. My boyfriend already wasn't helping with my daughter, so he agreed to pay for an abortion. I got on the internet to find information and came across your website. Needless to say my son is a handsome and healthy four year old today because of your website. I truly believe that your site saved his life. I watched "The Silent Scream" and I knew I may not be the greatest mom, but I'd rather be a strugling parent than a murderer. Thank you for posting honest photos and information on your site.

I am not proud to say that I had an abortion.

My punishment is that less then a month later I ended up in the emergency room, hemorrhaging from the procedure. The nurse wanted to admit me, as I had such blood loss I was dehydrated, but the on-call OB said to just keep me in the ER. He knew the other doctor in town who performed the procedure and I believe he was covering for the other doctor. My mother was called without my knowing, she came to see me, but they did not tell me she came to check on me.
I was released the next morning, and regardless of how I felt or what became of me I knew it was punishment. I have lived with the guilt ever since.

I cannot understand why and how in America this goes on! This is the most disturbing news that I have ever come across. My sister's daughter had 3 in a year and laughed about it. I thought that was awful!

ONE MORE THING-
You claim that the woman in the abortion has no risk...tell that to these women who DIED from it.

The slain women listed are only the ones we know of. Most women killed by abortionists are hidden from the public by disguising the cause of death. Abortion will never be safe and legal.

It is of noteworthy that some of these "doctors" are multiple killers. Edward Allred has three kills to his name . Often an abortionist will lose his medical license in one state, and simply move to another and continue his or her grisly practice.

Name
Age Race
Date Place of Death
Abortionist / Murderer
Source of Information

Eunice Agbagaa 26 Black 1/15/89 Brooklyn, NY Abram Zelikman NY Daily News 1/16/89
Mickey Apodaca 29 Hispanic 4/11/84 El Paso, TX Raymond Showery Des Moines Register 5/5/84
Gloria Apont 20 Hispanic 4/29/86 Stanford, CT Hanan Rotem Associated Press, 11/22/89
Jackie Bailey 29 Black 12/3/77 Los Angeles, CA C. Eboreime LA Coroner Report X77-14563
Myrta Baptiste 26 Hispanic 12/18/82 Miami, FL Unknown Miami Herald, 1/5/83
Brenda Benton 36 Black 4/20/87 Chicago, IL Susan Zivkovic Cook Co. Court #89L 2906
Janet Lally Blaum 37 White 3/11/74 New Orleans, LA Sidney Knight Jefferson Parish Ct #168-162
Cassandra Blevins 20 Black 8/18/71 Los Angeles, CA Unknown LA Coroner Report *71-10001
Diane Boyd 19 Black 10/23/81 St, Louis, MO Robert Crist St. Louis Court #812-11077
Dorothy Brown 37 Black 8/16/74 Chicago, IL Unknown Chicago Sun-Times 11/19/78
Belinda Byrd 37 Black 1/27/87 Los Angeles, CA Stephen Pine LA Co. Sup. Ct. #SWC 90298
Maria Cardemone 18 White 8/16/89 Pittsburgh, PA Unknown Pittsburgh Press 9/26/91
Geneva Calton 23 White 7/18/79 Atlanta, GA Unknown NRL News, Oct'79, pg 11
Teresa Causey 17 Black 12/3/88 Macon, GA Joe McDaniel Macon Telegraph 12/15/88
Patricia Chacon 16 Hispanic 3/3/84 Los Angeles, CA Edward Allred LA Coroner Case #84-2948

plus many more.

And one last thing. Have you ever seen an aborted baby?. Go to this website and I can guarantee you will puke your guts out.
http://www.mttu.com/abort-pics/

steen · Joined: 14 Jan 2006 Posts: 1430 Location: Upper Midwest

Nicholas wrote: steen wrote:
Quote: And a member here made an exceptionally valid point. To address the commonly raised point of it being the mother's body, is it acceptable to kill someone on a plot of land you own? If they are bodily threatening you, you certainly can. Which means that, when a woman's life is not threatened, abortion should always remain illegal. False. You can respond to threats of bodily harm, even if it won't kill you.

Quote: It's a necessity. A vast amount of abortions are carried out predominantly to the ''inconvenience'', not life-threatening circumstances. irrelevant, as the law clearly shows the issue being her right to control her own bodily resources.

Quote: There's a marginal difference between the two as the segment between choice (inconvenience) and compulsory (life-threatening) are quite blatant. Abortion by demand regarding health issues is mortally important than choice as it is surefire to connect with her error of judgment. Anticipating the ramifications can surprisingly save you the bother and, your dejected emotional feelings in a long run. None too many comprehend this. Evidence, please.

Quote: Abortion is constitutional by demand, but I strongly oppose the constitution as unconstitutional. Do you know what an "oxy-moron" is?

Quote: The factors in determining a woman's right and the worth of life is abundantly inconsistent and needs to be revised. You don't Steen, I do. I don't what??

Quote: Quote: Obligation to give birth is disgusting, it is oppressive slavery, and nobody should ever be forced to do so solely for the potential that might reside in mindless- non-sentient, non-sensate tissue. Your comment indicates that you show the future prospect of life as something of absolute no worth. A falsehood. It has the worth that the woman who gives bodily resources to support it, assigns it.

Quote: A baby before birth is, There is no such thing. It is as silly as a "pre-dead corpse."

Quote: of course, occupied by living attributes otherwise it wouldn't survive. It's a living life Nobody have denied this.

Quote: and deserves to live. Why? We are judging lots of life as not deserving to die. Next time you kill a mosquito, that is exactly what you are doing.

Quote: Quote: That is misogynistic oppression and enslavement of women. You are a shining example of what the pro-life agenda is all about. Forcing, oppressing and subduing women into slavery.
You seek to confiscate, oppress and force woman to abandon an INNOCENT life. That is an outright lie. Please cease lying about me.

Quote: You are a shining example of what the pro-death agenda is all about. Forcing, oppressing and subduing life into cruel terminations. Your lies and sophistry is a shining demonstration of pro-life methods and agendas.

Quote: Quote: Does women have a duty to sacrifice themselves against their will for the "good of humanity"? I think so. You know, that doesn't surprise me one bit. That is the ultimate in misogyny.

Quote: Having good humanity shows that you have good compassion toward life or an up and coming life. You see the opposite. You are diminishing the public confidence of women in having any faith in preserving life. nope. I see women as persons in their own right, rather as merely forced breeders.

Quote: Smoke screening the failed responsibility is what you see as a way of representing her RIGHTS, nor anything else other than notwithstanding. It's a shame. What the heck are you blabbering about?

Quote: Quote: Nope, there simply is no other way of looking at it.
There is. You can't see it. Anything that excludes her rights, you attack with piffle. Huh? Of course I attack anything that takes rights way from women. Such theocratic, hate mongering oppression and slavery is completely unacceptable. That is the very reason why I am here.

Quote: Balderdash. Again, your comment is of something to engulf the truth. You compare an inanimate doll to a life. I'm sorry, but that is quite absurd. Well, all you were doing was spewing emotional histrionics.

Quote: There is absolutely no comparisons. Having to live with the fact that, an abortionist terminated an innocent life in a woman's body is inconceivable for us. No, only for you personally. But since you are not living her life, that is utterly irrelevant to anybody but yourself.

Quote: The operation is likely to leave a negative forlorn scar on her life. False.

Quote: You've said that, women ''mainly'' feel relief? Once again, another smoke screen to back your blanket statements. Please point out somewhere that women feel relief, Steen. A majority do SUFFER the severe consequences of abortions. There's no doubt in that. Yes, there is. You are lying:

Major B, Cozzarelli C, Cooper ML, Zubek J, Richards C, Wilhite M & Gramzow RH (2000). Psychological response of women after first-trimester abortion. Archives of General Psychiatry (57), 77-784).

Russo NF & Dabul AJ (1997). The relationship of abortion to well-being: Do race and religion make a difference? Professional Psychology: Research and Practice (28), 23-31

Lydon J et al. (1996). Pregnancy decision making as a significant life event: A comittment approach. Journal of Personal and Social Psychology, 71, 141-151.

Gilchrist AC et al. (1995). Termination of pregnancy and psychiatric morbidity. British Journal of Psychiatry, 167, 243-248.

Cozzarelli C et al. (1994). The effects of anti-abortion demonstrators and pro-choice escorts on women's psychological response to abortions. Journal of Social and Clinical Psychology, 13, 404-427.

Major B et al. (1992). Psychosocial predictors of adjustment to abortion. Journal of Social Issues, 48, 121-142.

Russo NF et al. (1992). Abortion, childbearing and women's well-being. Professional Psychology: Research and Practice, 23, 269-280.

Adler NE et al. (1992). Psychological factors in abortion: An overview. American Journal of Psychology, 47, 1194-1204.

Adler NE et al. (1990). Psychological responses after abortions. Science, 47, 248, 41-43.

Dag g PKB (1991). The psychological sequelae of therapeutic abortion-Denied and completed. American Journal of Psychiatry, 148, 578-585.

Blumenthal SJ (1991). Psychiatric consequenses of abortion, an overview. In NL Scotland (ed.). Psychiatric aspects of abortion, pp. 17-38. Washington, DC: American Psychiatric Press.

Zabin LS et al. (1989). When urban adolescents choose abortion: Effects on education, psychological status, and subsequent pregnancy. Family Planning Perspective, 21, 248-255.

Mueller P et al. (1989). Self-blame, self-efficacy, and adjustment to abortion. Journal of Personal and Social Psychology, 57, 1059-1068.

Schwartz RA (1986). Abortion on request: The psychiatric implications. In JD Butler et al. (eds.). Abortion, medicine, and the law (3rd ed.; pp. 323-340). NY: File.

Major, B et al. (1985). Attributions, expectations, and coping with abortion. Journal of Personal and Social Psychology, 48, 585-599.

David HP (1981). Postpartum and postabortion psychotic reactions. Family Planning Perspective, 13, 88-92.

Shusterman L (1979). Predicting the psychological consequenses of of abortion: Social Science Medicine, 13, 683-689.

National Academy of Sciences (1975). Legalized abortion and the public health. Washington, DC: author.

Adler, NE (1975). Emotional responses of women following therapeutic abortion. American Journal of Orthopsychiatry, 45, 446-454.

Athanasiou R et al. (1975). Psychiatric sequellae to term birth and induced early and late abortions. Family Practice Perspectives, 5, 227-231.

Quote: Quote: Nonsense. YOU demanding the woman be forced into slavery is the TRUE display of lack of compassion. Irrational. YOU are demanding the careless woman to accept obligations to have an abortion from her unwanted pregnancy, A flat-out lie.

Quote: does truly display your LACK of compassion towards innocent life. Steen, you are also a hypocrite. No, you are merely lying about me. That doesn't say anything about me, only about your inability to post the truth.

Quote: Quote: Ah, how noble of you. If she will DIE, then it is OK to have an abortion. gee, your underwhelming compassion and empathy for womens health and wellbeing is sad to witness. Like I said above, you think it is OK to have an abortion in whatever the circumstances are, as long as it's choice, whether it's guilty conscience or immoral. ]Sure. It is none of your or my business why women seek an abortion.

Quote: This illustrates your underwhelming compassion for the future of a newborn not being able to live. A lie again. I have said nothing about newborns.
ZZZZ

steen · Joined: 14 Jan 2006 Posts: 1430 Location: Upper Midwest

A Promise Kept wrote: When do you think life begins? life began 3.8-4 bill years ago. Hominid life began about 8-10 mill years ago. Human life began about 125,000 years ago. The life of an individual begins at birth. The life of the conceptus begins at conception, but with the caveat that the components have been alive for much longer than that.

Quote: Women don't know for sure that they are pregnant until about five or six days before their missed period. That gives the embryo time to develop. Mindless, non-sentient, non-sensate tissue. So what?

Quote: A baby has a heartbeat after 6 weeks of pregnancy. That would be an embryo, mindless, non-sentient, non-sensate tissue rather than a "baby." So what?

Quote: Abortion can cost up to $700 And giving birth can cost up to close to $50,000. SO what?

Quote: and scheduling one takes at least a week or two, giving the baby more time to develop. Still no baby. Mindless, non-sentient, non-sensate tissue. So what?

Quote: No I don't think women should be enslaved. I just think that people should take responsibility for their actions. So you are not pro-fault, but rather pro-fault. Your focus is on moral judgment of women and casting judgment on them, using unwanted pregnancies as punishment for them not living their life as you feel they should. Yes, your misogyny is already known, so this doesn't surprise me.

Quote: Oh and you don't think women are enslaved?...they aren't enslaved, but they are exploited and alienated with pressure to be "perfect" or hollywood material. yes, the patriarchy has set up nonsense roles. Anything that helps women break free of these and take charge of her own life and body is a good thing.

Quote: The ideal woman these days to most people (not me) that women are supposed to be the man's b****, so they are pressured into sex by men most of the time, really? Who says this is the ideal woman? certainly, I argue that the ideal woman is the one the woman herself want to be. SHE is the expert in her own life. You and I are not. So we should leave her decisions about her own life to her.

Quote: but everybody has had a health class or two in their lifetime and doesn't take a rocket scientist to know that you could very well get pregnant when having sex. That may or may not happen. Most intercourse does NOT lead to pregnancy.

Quote: So it is both the man and women's fault. If your not ready to take the responsibility of the possibilty of a child then you should not have sex. There is no child to birth. And taking charge of one's own body and having an abortion is very much to take responsibility for one's own situation, just like giving birth would be.

Quote: You can choose to but its a risk. There are so many people out there who can't have children who would love to have children, AH, nothing like forced breeding to help them. Yeah, another splendid, pro-life excuse for slavery: Make her breed so others can have children. Margaret Atwood was right.

Quote: so if you just put the baby up for adoption then your blessing someone who is less fortunate then you. Adoption is a parenting decision, not a pregnancy decision. And this is her decision, not yours.

Quote: Here are some facts

In a 2003 Gallup poll in the United States, 72% of respondents were in favor of spousal notification, with 26% opposed; of those polled, 79% of males and 67% of females responded in favor. Irrelevant.

Quote: Personal accounts of Abortions

HI...

I WAS 17YRS OLD, WHEN I HAD MY ABORTION. .......
http://www.imnotsorry.net/storyarchive.htm

Quote: ONE MORE THING-
You claim that the woman in the abortion has no risk...tell that to these women who DIED from it. Sure. All medical events have risks. 3-12 women die yearly from 1+ mill abortions. 350-550 women die yearly from 4.5 mill births. Giving birth is more than 10 times as dangerous as having an abortion. Nice try.

Quote: And one last thing. Have you ever seen an aborted baby? Such a thing doesn't exist. But I certainly have seen aborted embryos and fetuses. Several times, actually.

Quote: . Go to this website and I can guarantee you will puke your guts out. Ah, fetal porn. No, I went there and didn't puke out my guts. I have seen much worse. take a look at open-heart surgery. Or amputation of diabetic gangrenous legs. Oh, the sting and brown ooze, mixed with the leg lying there, now THAT is gross. Guess we should outlaw amputations. Emotional platitudes might excite and arouse you, but it really doesn't do much for me. If all you have is emotional histrionics and sophistry, then you don't have much to offer. try some meaningful facts next time
http://www.mttu.com/abort-pics/[/quote]

A Promise Kept · Joined: 11 Apr 2006 Posts: 93

So what your basically saying from the website you had, the only way women can make it in this world is by not having children. Because I read like 4 or 5 of those posts and each one of them was because of money. I want to be successful before i have kids. I need to get control of my life. I believe that any woman who has a child and may be a single mom is one of the strongest people I'd ever met. I have met a lot of mothers whose father of the child walked out, and you know what. They didn't just give up. Thats what an abortion is. Giving up. Congratulations you just let the government win anyway. You're also saying that women are crappy mothers and can't take care of a child. Women have choices. The choice to be successful and the choice to be some woman exploiting themselves in a rap video and become a S***. I'd rather meet a woman who was poor as hell and worked like three different jobs to provide for her family than meet a Hollywood star. For those people who get abortions they are giving up and are not concerned at all for other women's rights. I'm pretty sure not all women are pro-abortion..pro-death....errr pro-choice.
So only rich people can have abortions and poor people can't...yep. also rich people provide a better childhood for the kid. false.
You think that children are just extra baggage that needs to be lugged around. If a woman has an abortion she shows no remorse, while If a woman has the baby she's automatically going to be miserable. Abortion shows that people are cowards. Abortions aren't sanitary, because have you seen all the blood that gets EVERYWHERE. Abortionists are not real doctors..doctors save people, there is no saving anybody here.

AmericaFirst

The Grandmaster wrote:

Exactly. They use a few buzzwords and hope people roll over and play dead, all the while, trying to curtail what their religious fairly tales and cartoons in the sky all deem in immoral and bad, namely, sex.

I've tried to avoid this section of the forum for this very example: people making ABSURD assumptions about the "real reason" someone is "pro-life". I use quotations because I feel that term does not include me. (That and because this subject brings out the worst in me and engaging in conversation about it helps ruin my day...)

It's got NOTHING to do with sex and to make that claim is just RIDICULOUS. While I admire your eloquent use of the english language and obvious intelligence, this statement betrays you.

It's not all about "religion" to some of us (and yes, I AM a Christian). It's about people who fail to act responsibly and then end up killing a fetus - in essence, not even giving a life a chance. That said, when I mention 'fail to act responsibly' it's not about NOT having sex. It's about USING precautions and birth control. This ALSO concerns the HUGE number of illegitimate children out there - not because of the "immorality" of it but because it just goes to create more generations of welfare recipients and people who don't stand a chance in life for the most part.

Yeah, I KNOW it is somewhat of a contradiction unless you REALLY GET what I am saying. If we STOP trivializing sex and it's consequences, 13 year olds will not be getting pregnant as often as they do now, AIDS won't be spreading as rampantly as it does and finally, yes, abortion will become a last resort and NOT a convenient way out....

Go have sex all you want - just be prepared to deal with the consequences and not just KILL the consequences or end up taking taxpayers for a ride with the ludicrous need for "social services" and handouts...

spearsy23 · Joined: 24 Oct 2005 Posts: 5633 Location: Fulton, Ks

A Promise Kept wrote: Personal accounts of Abortions

HI...

I WAS 17YRS OLD, WHEN I HAD MY ABORTION. I AM NOW 22 YEARS OLD AND TILL THIS DAY REGRET WHAT I DID. THEIR IS NOT A DAY THAT GOES BY THAT I DON'T TRY TO IMAGINE HOW MY BABY WOULD HAVE LOOKED LIKE. WOULD THE BABY HAD BEEN A GIRL OR BOY WOLD THE BABY LOOK LIKE ME OR LIKE THE DADDY.

YOU KNOW I WENT TO THE ABORTION CLINIC 2X BEFORE I COULD DO WHAT I DID. WHEN I FIRST WENT IN THE STAFF DID ALL THE EXAMS THAT THEY HAD TO DO BEFORE THE ABORTION AND THEN THEY SAT ME IN A WAITING ROOM FULL OF GIRLS, GIRLS WAITING FOR THE SAME THING I WAS WAITING FOR " THE ABORTION".

BUT THE ONLY DIFFERENCE BETWEEN ME AND THOSE OTHER GIRLS WAS THAT I DID NOT WANT THIS... I THOUGHT AT THE TIME THAT, THIS WAS MY ONLY OPTION AND IT WAS THIS OR NOTHING. THE OTHER GIRLS WERE HAPPY THEY WERE GETTING THE ABORTION THEY SPOKE ABOUT HOW THEY COULD NOT WAIT TO GET THE BABY OUT OF THEM SO THEY COULD GO BACK TO THEIR LIFE STYLES. I WAS THE ONLY ONE SITTING IN THE CORNER, CRYING. FINALLY I GOT UP AND RAN OUT OF THE ABORTION CLINIC.

BUT 2 DAYS LATTER I WENT BACK AND WENT THROUGH WITH IT. I DID NOT WANT TO DO IT BUT I HAD NO OTHER CHOICE IN MY MIND. I NEED THE GIRLS WHO READ THIS LIFE STORY TO KNOW EVERY ONE HAS ANOTHER CHOICE, EVERY ONE... DON'T SETTLE FOR THIS ONE. I WISH I COULD GO BACK AND CHANGE WHAT I DID BECAUSE THEN I WOULD HAVE MY BABY, MY FUTURE A PART OF ME.

I.

To whom it may concern:

I became pregnant for the first time at the age of 14. Being young I stupidly tried to will it away. By the time my mom found out I was almost five months. She took me to the doctor for the sole purpose of trying pressure me into scheduling an abortion. The doctor had said because so big the "procedure" would take 2 days but once I went through with day 1 it would be too late to change my mind. She used the word "baby" not "fetus". My mom told me to "sleep on it." The next morning I told my mom I couldn't go through with it and My daughter is now 6 years old. I'm not a religious person, I just thougt it seemed wrong, even though I didn't even know about abortion then, to be pregnant and then to do anything to end being pregnant felt unnatural to me. At the age of 16 I became pregnant again. Already knowing full well what I had gotten myself into I decided I should get and abortion. My boyfriend already wasn't helping with my daughter, so he agreed to pay for an abortion. I got on the internet to find information and came across your website. Needless to say my son is a handsome and healthy four year old today because of your website. I truly believe that your site saved his life. I watched "The Silent Scream" and I knew I may not be the greatest mom, but I'd rather be a strugling parent than a murderer. Thank you for posting honest photos and information on your site.

I am not proud to say that I had an abortion.

My punishment is that less then a month later I ended up in the emergency room, hemorrhaging from the procedure. The nurse wanted to admit me, as I had such blood loss I was dehydrated, but the on-call OB said to just keep me in the ER. He knew the other doctor in town who performed the procedure and I believe he was covering for the other doctor. My mother was called without my knowing, she came to see me, but they did not tell me she came to check on me.
I was released the next morning, and regardless of how I felt or what became of me I knew it was punishment. I have lived with the guilt ever since.

I cannot understand why and how in America this goes on! This is the most disturbing news that I have ever come across. My sister's daughter had 3 in a year and laughed about it. I thought that was awful!

Appeals to emotion are very bad for a debate. I could care less what these people say, and there are plenty of other accounts that are glad they had the abortions. Likewise for the pictures of third trimester (? i believe that's the later stage) abortions. It makes you look like you can't win an argument without trying to make people feel regret and sorrow. Most of the time it doesn't work.

A Promise Kept · Joined: 11 Apr 2006 Posts: 93

well then people are inhumane and selfish.

spearsy23 · Joined: 24 Oct 2005 Posts: 5633 Location: Fulton, Ks

A Promise Kept wrote: well then people are inhumane and selfish.

Inhumane because we value logic and reason over emotion?

The selfish part doesn't make any sense, so i'll disregard that.

Sorry but anybody can look up gross or sad pictures/stories but it takes actual brains to debate.

steen · Joined: 14 Jan 2006 Posts: 1430 Location: Upper Midwest

A Promise Kept wrote: well then people are inhumane and selfish. Ah, not wallowing in the same emotional histrionics that you engages in makes us inhumane and selfish? being in touch with reality is now bad? This is beginning to be rather lame, APK.

joe christian · Joined: 27 Feb 2006 Posts: 282

The Underground wrote: joe christian wrote: The Underground wrote:

Minority? www.pollingreport.com/abortion.htm

If asked whether child-killers should have the legal right to kill off American children any time they feel like it and without their parent's knowledge or consent though, 99.9% of the US population would say no to such a radical feminist and abortionist agenda.

Without the parents consent? so are you saying doctors are sneaking into pregnant womens bedrooms and giving them abortions?
Just about, except like most adulterers, they prefer to invite the woman over to their place where the babies father or the woman's husband can neither protest nor prove the adulterous abortionist's destructive behavior.

spearsy23 · Joined: 24 Oct 2005 Posts: 5633 Location: Fulton, Ks

joe christian wrote: The Underground wrote: joe christian wrote: The Underground wrote:

Minority? www.pollingreport.com/abortion.htm

If asked whether child-killers should have the legal right to kill off American children any time they feel like it and without their parent's knowledge or consent though, 99.9% of the US population would say no to such a radical feminist and abortionist agenda.

Without the parents consent? so are you saying doctors are sneaking into pregnant womens bedrooms and giving them abortions?
Just about, except like most adulterers, they prefer to invite the woman over to their place where the babies father or the woman's husband can neither protest nor prove the adulterous abortionist's destructive behavior.
And i'm SURE you have proof of this. So would you mind showing it to me?

Also the mother woule know i'm pretty sure.

joe christian · Joined: 27 Feb 2006 Posts: 282

The Underground wrote: joe christian wrote: The Underground wrote: Without the parents consent? so are you saying doctors are sneaking into pregnant womens bedrooms and giving them abortions?
Just about, except like most adulterers, they prefer to invite the woman over to their place where the babies father or the woman's husband can neither protest nor prove the adulterous abortionist's destructive behavior.
And i'm SURE you have proof of this. So would you mind showing it to me?
We have no evidence of any legal abortions being performed in a woman's bedroom without her husband's informed consent.

Quote: Also the mother woule know i'm pretty sure.
Yes, but they are not talking.

sgtshortness · Joined: 17 Mar 2006 Posts: 82

Quote: We have no evidence of any legal abortions being performed in a woman's bedroom without her husband's informed consent.

He's talking about forced abortions on women when he says a doctor "sneaks into pregnant women's bedrooms." Which would be illegal anyways.

Quote: Yes, but they are not talking

Meaning what? Are you talking about forced abortions or voluntary abortions?

joe christian · Joined: 27 Feb 2006 Posts: 282

sgtshortness wrote: Quote: We have no evidence of any legal abortions being performed in a woman's bedroom without her husband's informed consent.

He's talking about forced abortions on women when he says a doctor "sneaks into pregnant women's bedrooms." Which would be illegal anyways.

Quote: Yes, but they are not talking

Meaning what? Are you talking about forced abortions or voluntary abortions?
All abortions which are performed without the father's consent are forced.

spearsy23 · Joined: 24 Oct 2005 Posts: 5633 Location: Fulton, Ks

joe christian wrote: sgtshortness wrote: Quote: We have no evidence of any legal abortions being performed in a woman's bedroom without her husband's informed consent.

He's talking about forced abortions on women when he says a doctor "sneaks into pregnant women's bedrooms." Which would be illegal anyways.

Quote: Yes, but they are not talking

Meaning what? Are you talking about forced abortions or voluntary abortions?
All abortions which are performed without the father's consent are forced.

You don't understand the concept of "forced" do you? How is a mother who gets an abortion forced into it? You say it, but you don't appear to be able to back it up.

sgtshortness · Joined: 17 Mar 2006 Posts: 82

If you mean forced upon the father in that "his" fetus is killed, then yes it is.

If you mean forced as in the woman herself is forced to get the abortion, then no.

A Promise Kept · Joined: 11 Apr 2006 Posts: 93

Actually a woman is forced to get an abortion. If she decides to get an abortion and then during the abortion decides to CHANGE her mind, she can't. After the first day of the operation (total of 2 days) she can't back out. So if she doesn't want an abortion, she can't change the fact that she is getting an abortion. She has to live with it.

sgtshortness · Joined: 17 Mar 2006 Posts: 82

She chose to get the abortion by walking in the first day.

steen · Joined: 14 Jan 2006 Posts: 1430 Location: Upper Midwest

A Promise Kept wrote: Actually a woman is forced to get an abortion. If she decides to get an abortion and then during the abortion decides to CHANGE her mind, she can't. After the first day of the operation (total of 2 days) she can't back out. So if she doesn't want an abortion, she can't change the fact that she is getting an abortion. She has to live with it. What 2 days are you talking about? She shows up, gets the D&C and goes home. Do you KNOW what the typical abortion is like? Sure sounds like you never contemplated what abortions actually are, normally.

spearsy23 · Joined: 24 Oct 2005 Posts: 5633 Location: Fulton, Ks

A Promise Kept wrote: Actually a woman is forced to get an abortion. If she decides to get an abortion and then during the abortion decides to CHANGE her mind, she can't. After the first day of the operation (total of 2 days) she can't back out. So if she doesn't want an abortion, she can't change the fact that she is getting an abortion. She has to live with it.

first WHAT THE HELL ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT.

Second that's like saying a murderer was forced into it after he killed the person but then didn't want to have killed them.