Political Crossfire Forums

[Glorfindel]

I would like you all to read this article

Quote: IRON, as it appears in the Quran




IN THE NAME OF GOD, THE MOST GRACIOUS, THE MOST MERCIFUL



Science and religion have been two most ardent enemies for centuries, what religion believes in, is rejected by science and what the science proves, is refuted by religion. In the Quran, we have a Scripture which is not only mathematically coded, but has numerous verses with scientific implications, far advanced than the time of it's revelation. The astounding nature of these veses serves to re-iterate that the Quran's source is divine, no human could have known so many of these facts fourteen centuries ago.

This article examines Iron, as it occurs in the Quran - the subject of Sura (chapter) 57.

Sura 57th is named after the element iron, Al Hadid (amazingly, the gematrical values of the Arabic letters also add up to 57). It is placed right in the middle of the Quran, and it is chosen out of all the elements of the world for a reason. There are 114 Suras in the Quran. 56 Suras before Sura Iron, and 57 Suras after.

The Almighty introduces Iron to us in Sura 57:25: "... And we sent down the iron, in which there is strength and many benefits for the people…"

This verse marks the 26th occurrence of the word God (Allah) from the beginning of this sura. 26 also happens to be the Atomic Number of iron! Very much like a fingerprint that is unique for every human being, and no two human beings have the same fingerprint, the Atomic Number of an element is also unique for that element. Chemically, iron is a metal, and is the 26th element in the Periodic Table, (atomic number=26), but it has the Atomic Mass Number of 56.

The Periodic Table is an arrangement of known elements according to their Atomic Mass. It was first compiled in 1869, by a Russian chemist called Dimitri Mendeleev. The elements are identified and placed according to their chemical behavior and Atomic/Molecular Mass Number. Some have been discovered already, and others are made in the laboratory. Still others have not yet been discovered.

The table starts with the lightest element of the world, which is Hydrogen, and which has a molecular mass of 1. The last one on the Table is the 106th element, Seaborgium. This element is named after Professor Seaborge of Berkeley University, and is not found in the nature, but has been synthesized in very small quantity in the laboratory.

The Molecular Mass is the sum of the masses of atoms, which make up the element.Iron (denoted by the symbol: Fe), and is the 26th element on the table.

Here are some other interesting mathematical observations with regards to Iron:

Verse 25 of Sura 57 is the 19th verse from the beginning of the sura, where the word God (Allah) is mentioned. If we count all the occurrence of the word God from the beginning of the Quran including 57:25 the total occurrence is 2443. Notice that Sura 43 is the 24th initialed Sura and Sura 43 has 89 verses. Number 89 is the 24th prime number.

Some of the benefits of iron are:

The vitamins and minerals, which are beneficial for our bodies, have been discovered in the 20th century and are part of our daily nutrition; iron is one of these minerals. Iron is present in our blood hemoglobin and without it the chance of survival is limited. (Iron is present in liver, spinach and certain vegetables). Pregnant women are recommended to take iron pills to the benefit of both themselves and their babies. To enhance the growth of the plants, trees, we feed them with iron that eventually will benefit the human beings. Iron is used in cast iron in structures, buildings, bridges, and skyscrapers for its strength. It is used in machinery, equipment, cars, engines, airplanes, boats, space shuttles etc.

Why Iron? Iron is the third most abundant element of the world; (Silicon is first. Aluminum, is the second, 5% of the earth crust contains iron.

Where did iron come from? Scientist now know how iron got on planet earth and in fact there is an extensive article in Time magazine[1] about the function of iron, and the critical role it played in the formation of life:

In the beginning, approximately 4.6 billion years ago, when planet earth was being formed, there was hydrogen, carbon, nitrogen, oxygen, and iron in space. These molecules were formed at the BIG Bang, and iron started to soak up the oxygen. This prevented the carbon and the nitrogen from reacting with oxygen. If, oxygen had combined with these two elements, carbon dioxide and nitrogen oxides would have been formed, which are both hazardous gases for human beings. Instead, iron reacted with oxygen and turned into rust, (this is the reaction that happens between iron and oxygen when it forms ferric oxide). This gave carbon and the nitrogen a chance, which both reacted with hydrogen and formed methane and ammonia. Subsequently, these two compounds eventually formed DNA (the building block of the living creatures).

After the radioactive elements slowly increased the temperature of the planet earth, the iron that was on the surface of the earth for 100 millions of years, started to melt and reached the core.

According to Science News Magazine[2], the earth 's iron core lies 2,900 kilometer below our feet. It has proved less accessible than the outer reaches of the solar system! The earth's inner core remains a solid despite the heat deep inside the planet.

Surrounding this hard center lies the outer core, which are molten iron and other lighter elements. The movement of these fluids is important because they generate Earth's magnetic field, one of the factors which help this planet to be hospitable for life. In the 21st century, if we were to open the core of the earth, we will only see iron as the major element (there is a very low percentage of nickel present too). This explains the electromagnetic field of the planet earth. If you take a compass it will show you the direction of the north.

In Sura 17 verse 49 we read: They said, "After we turn into fragments, we get resurrected anew? 17:50 Say, Even if you turn into rocks or iron.

This verse contains remarkable insight:

All the matters seek the most stable state, which is the lowest energy level. Iron is the most stable element in the world according to Quantum Mechanics, therefore given time, all matters will eventually reach the most stable state, that is they will be converted into Iron !

As you can see for yourself, a lot of the information related to iron, has only come to light in the the 20th century, and later. These details were certainly not known in the 6th century, when Quran was revealed.

Some may argue that at the time of Prophet Mohammed, iron did of course exist, and therefore could be detailed (in the Quran). While it may be true that some of their tools and utensils were made of iron, it is almost certain that they did not have the information of the key role iron plays in life. They could not possibly have known of its presence in the core of the earth, it's presence in our blood, it's atomic number, and many other benefits which are crucial to life.

As a matter of fact, one cannot help but ask, why a sura on iron? Why not a sura on silver and gold? Even with all this information, some may still say this is just coincidence. If it is all just coincidence, then it is truly an awesome coincidence.

However, logic, and the laws of odds, point to these phenomena not being a result of mere coincidences. Once that realisation is reached, the only possible, humbling, response would be to give thanks and proclaim that glory be to God, Lord of the Universe. Creator of all things, Creator of the heavens and the earth, the Seer the Hearer, the Knower, the Most Merciful, the Most Gracious, the Initiator, the One God, the Only God, the Almighty, the Alpha and the Omega.


Manije Khorasani
March,2001



now ask yourself, How did the Prophet Mohammed, who didnt even know how to read and write, get his hands on this information about the origin of Iron?

for those who are muslim, this is something that will amaze you and strenghten your faith

for those who are not, this is something to think about.

Peace

[acerbus80]

pretty amazing for a guy who couldn't even get his facts straight on whether Allah created the heavens or the earth first.

http://answering-islam.org.uk/Quran/Contra/i012.html

[Dagger]

786 bucks says someone is gonna say it was added later on.


PC

[Glorfindel]

acerbus80 wrote: pretty amazing for a guy who couldn't even get his facts straight on whether Allah created the heavens or the earth first.

http://answering-islam.org.uk/Quran/Contra/i012.html

did you read the " Muslim response" in that link you provided? I think it will give you a clear answer of the word "then" in arabic and its meaning...

here is the link for that response in case you didnt see it

http://answering-islam.org.uk/Quran/Contra/i012d.html

I hope your comment was of well-intentions

[Saracen]

Quote: pretty amazing for a guy who couldn't even get his facts straight on whether Allah created the heavens or the earth first.

http://answering-islam.org.uk/Quran/Contra/i012.html

Stop looking at Anti-Islamic sources to learn about Islam.

And Glorfindel, excellent post. For this, I will start up a post about science and Islam. :tu:

[cap'n queasy]

Quote: The Almighty introduces Iron to us in Sura 57:25: "... And we sent down the iron, in which there is strength and many benefits for the people…"

I found it curious that this book address the the Almighty in a plural form.

Trinity?

[Saracen]

Trinity? Not really. This plural form is the Plurality of Greatness (can't remember the exact Arabic name for this form).

[cap'n queasy]

Hmm.

[Saracen]

Seriously. We don't believe that God is part of a Trinity. There are other verses in the Koran that say so. If you want, I can give you a few of them...

[cap'n queasy]

Oh, I believe you.

What is the Muslim opinion on the existence of the Ruach HaKodesh, the Holy Spirit, from Scripture?

What do you think it is?

[Saracen]

Ohhh. You mean "Al Rouh El Quddus"? Notice the similarity between this Arabic phrase and the Hebrew phrase you mentioned.

That's Gabriel (Jibreel), the Archangel. He's "Quddus" (sacred) because he revealed God's words to the Prophet Muhammad (PBUH); these words formed the Koran.

He's not a divinity, though.

[pharaoh]

About the trinity:

5:72 They do blaspheme who say: "God is Christ the son of Mary." But said Christ: "O Children of Israel! worship God, my Lord and your Lord." Whoever joins other gods with God,- God will forbid him the garden, and the Fire will be his abode. There will for the wrong-doers be no one to help.
5:73 They do blaspheme who say: God is one of three in a Trinity: for there is no god except One God. If they desist not from their word (of blasphemy), verily a grievous penalty will befall the blasphemers among them.
5:74 Why turn they not to God, and seek His forgiveness? For God is Oft- forgiving, Most Merciful.
5:75 Christ the son of Mary was no more than an apostle; many were the apostles that passed away before him. His mother was a woman of truth. They had both to eat their (daily) food. See how God doth make His signs clear to them; yet see in what ways they are deluded away from the truth!

And cap'n queasy, what do you think about Glorfindel topic on Iron?

[Saracen]

WOW, pharaoh. How dumb of me to go off-topic for this guy... :lol:

Yeah, cap'n. Tell us... What do you think about this topic on iron?

[pharaoh]

Quote: WOW, pharaoh. How dumb of me to go off-topic for this guy...

no no I think its okay to answer anyone's questions, however, for Glorfindel's sake we need to go back to the main topic.
You did a great job answering his question. :wink: :tu:

[cap'n queasy]

Moath wrote: Ohhh. You mean "Al Rouh El Quddus"? Notice the similarity between this Arabic phrase and the Hebrew phrase you mentioned.

That's Gabriel (Jibreel), the Archangel. He's "Quddus" (sacred) because he revealed God's words to the Prophet Muhammad (PBUH); these words formed the Koran.

He's not a divinity, though.

Gabriel is an angel. The Holy Spirit is something else all together. According to what the scriptures say, anyway.

If Jesus is supposed to come back and set everything right that seems to indicate He is something more than a mere prophet, more than a man.

Thank for the explanation though, it is very enlightening.

What do I think of the Iron?

I think it is quite interesting. I don't know, really, what I make of it, as of yet. It would seem that saying this is merely a co-incidence is a bit weak to my way of thinking. I think it probably means something.

[Glorfindel]

Salam

first of all thank you Pharoah and Moath for responding to the other posts... I was kind of busy last week and I didnt have much time to check the forum

and that's a great idea Moath... go on ahead with that and may Allah reward you for that

[Glorfindel]

cap'n queasy wrote: Moath wrote: Ohhh. You mean "Al Rouh El Quddus"? Notice the similarity between this Arabic phrase and the Hebrew phrase you mentioned.

That's Gabriel (Jibreel), the Archangel. He's "Quddus" (sacred) because he revealed God's words to the Prophet Muhammad (PBUH); these words formed the Koran.

He's not a divinity, though.

Gabriel is an angel. The Holy Spirit is something else all together. According to what the scriptures say, anyway.

If Jesus is supposed to come back and set everything right that seems to indicate He is something more than a mere prophet, more than a man.

Thank for the explanation though, it is very enlightening.

What do I think of the Iron?

I think it is quite interesting. I don't know, really, what I make of it, as of yet. It would seem that saying this is merely a co-incidence is a bit weak to my way of thinking. I think it probably means something.

Cap'n

one of the main purposes of Quran is to invoke our reason and brains to think and observe the world around us...

it is very reasonable of you not to think of this as a coincidence..it would be insane to think that a man 1400 years ago could tell of the origin of Iron without divine teachings

maybe after you learn more about Islam and the miracle that is Quran you will have a different view of Islam

thx

[cap'n queasy]

Well, I'm pretty firm in my pesonal beliefs. But I do think it is a very interesting and relevent subject to discuss.

I thank you for your invitation.

[Glorfindel]

cap'n queasy wrote: Well, I'm pretty firm in my pesonal beliefs. But I do think it is a very interesting and relevent subject to discuss.

I thank you for your invitation.

I respect your personal beliefs but just dont be too firm to see the truth..dont be too firm to be reasonable and sensible

and please, dont deprive my posts from your valuable and interesting comments and it would always be my pleasure to answer any questions you got about Islam

thx

peace

[cap'n queasy]

Salaam. :-D