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toddytodd
Joined: 20 May 2006
Posts: 2736
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| Posted: Tue Jul 04, 2006 12:52 pm Post subject: |
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LetsGetReal wrote: I didn't say you had to I just believe its another way of professing your love for Jesus and what he did and same goes with communion.
I agree. Good point as well. Baptism and Communion are rituals done out of respect and honor and shouldn't be done by those who don't feel it necessary. |
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connermt
Joined: 27 Feb 2006
Posts: 1526
Location: CMH OHIO
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| Posted: Thu Jul 06, 2006 6:19 pm Post subject: |
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Hyde wrote: toddytodd wrote: connermt wrote: Todd D. wrote: You know what ticks me off more than anything? People that think that they know, for a fact, exactly what God wants. I find that to be presumptious to the absolute core. Oh, so it's an ignorant view of God to have an idea different than yours? That's great, how open-minded of you. Can you prove that your "truth" is correct, or that someone that disagrees with you is lacking knowledge on the subject?
What's double-funny is that by saying that you refuse to hear anything to the contrary, you are yourself being quite ignorant. That's really more amusing than anything else though.
Thank you for sharing :roll:
I didn't see ToddyTodd say anything about knowing what God WANTS. He was speaking about the belief, NOT about what God wants. Can you not see that?!? Obviously not. All he seemed to say was that if popular BELIEF of a 'all loving God' is going to bring a life into existence only to let it die & go to hell is hypocrytical of that all loving God. Or who knows, maybe everyone who thinks God is all loving is wrong. Besides, if that is truly the view of God, I (as well as many others) would want no part of him.
Obviously, if you didn't get the point, you are trying to save face. By all means please do if it validates your view of yourself. I doubt anyone but you cares.
I think (hope) he missed the point altogether. Which is fine. But you are correct, I mentioned nothing about what God wants, only the belief of a certain practice and the outcome if that practice isn't carried out. I am no biblical scholar, nor have I claimed to be. But logically, to bring a life into existence only to let it die and go to hell (which for those confused I am saying a baby die without the chance to be baptized and thus goes to Hell) is demented and quite contrary to the loving god persona that has been put forth by main stream Christianity.
So either that belief is wrong or that popular view of God is wrong, in my opinion. It isn't being closed minded to believe this and to say I doubt (or there is absolutely no way) anyone will be able to change my point of view on the matter. If someone thinks they can and desire to, I welcome it.
it is very ignorant to say this though
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it is ignorant to say this though
IGNORANT: "lacking knowledge or comprehension of the thing specified" or "destitute of knowledge or education" or "resulting from or showing lack of knowledge or intelligence".
When I said "For those who say that a baby goes to hell because there wasn't time to baptize, that it is a statement and belief beyond ignorant.", I could have said: "For those who say that a baby goes to hell because there wasn't time to baptize, that it is a statement and belief beyond comprehension of the thing specified or, "For those who say that a baby goes to hell because there wasn't time to baptize, that it is a statement and belief beyond ignorant (ignorant {resulting from or showing lack of knowledge or intelligence".})."
you said it lacks knowledge or itelegence. to say that makes you sound like you know God's will. which i can assure you, you do not as no man does.no one can cross out any beleif as impossible for we dont know if it is real or not. there is only personal beleif. most christians believe God is loving and caring but if you are sinful God will not let the sins go unpunished. i, like you, disagree with that belief, but to call it ignorant, is in itself ignorant.
p.s. keep your little friend connermt on a leash. by saying"By all means please do if it validates your view of yourself. I doubt anyone but you cares" he went out of line. connermt, please keep to the disscussion and talk about things relevant. and if you cant, kindly leave. :wink:
:roll:
Thanks for the suggestion - I will keep it in mind :wink:
Still doesn't seems anyone cares..... |
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issaiah1332
Joined: 29 Jun 2006
Posts: 465
Location: Wv
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| Posted: Thu Jul 06, 2006 6:31 pm Post subject: |
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Only1shot wrote: Jesus said you have to be reborn in spirit to enter the kingdom of heaven. To me this means that you do indeed have to be baptised to go to heaven.
Than what is the point of repenting? |
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toddytodd
Joined: 20 May 2006
Posts: 2736
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| Posted: Fri Jul 07, 2006 2:07 pm Post subject: |
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issaiah1332 wrote: Only1shot wrote: Jesus said you have to be reborn in spirit to enter the kingdom of heaven. To me this means that you do indeed have to be baptised to go to heaven.
Than what is the point of repenting?
To add to the question, then what is the difference in repenting or being baptized? |
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Hyde
Joined: 27 Feb 2006
Posts: 1062
Location: somewhere in nowhere
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| Posted: Fri Jul 07, 2006 3:58 pm Post subject: |
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Only1shot wrote: Jesus said you have to be reborn in spirit to enter the kingdom of heaven. To me this means that you do indeed have to be baptised to go to heaven.
then about 80% of the world is going to hell? that is insanity. what about the people that have never been introduced to christianity? they automaticaly go to hell because of where they where born and never got baptized? how ignorant can you get to say that only your religion can be right and everyone else is going to hell. |
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perdidochas
Joined: 06 Mar 2006
Posts: 15424
Location: Florida
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| Posted: Fri Jul 07, 2006 5:03 pm Post subject: |
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Hyde wrote: Only1shot wrote: Jesus said you have to be reborn in spirit to enter the kingdom of heaven. To me this means that you do indeed have to be baptised to go to heaven.
then about 80% of the world is going to hell? that is insanity. what about the people that have never been introduced to christianity? they automaticaly go to hell because of where they where born and never got baptized? how ignorant can you get to say that only your religion can be right and everyone else is going to hell.
Well, the Catholic view is that, if possible, you should be baptized. If not baptized, you still have a chance at salvation, it's just not as high. |
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Hyde
Joined: 27 Feb 2006
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Location: somewhere in nowhere
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| Posted: Fri Jul 07, 2006 5:14 pm Post subject: |
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perdidochas wrote: Hyde wrote: Only1shot wrote: Jesus said you have to be reborn in spirit to enter the kingdom of heaven. To me this means that you do indeed have to be baptised to go to heaven.
then about 80% of the world is going to hell? that is insanity. what about the people that have never been introduced to christianity? they automaticaly go to hell because of where they where born and never got baptized? how ignorant can you get to say that only your religion can be right and everyone else is going to hell.
Well, the Catholic view is that, if possible, you should be baptized. If not baptized, you still have a chance at salvation, it's just not as high.
thats not what i hear from catholics around my town? but maybe mine are a little extreme. and it is still treating people less and giving them less a chance of salvation then others just because of where they were born. |
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cap'n queasy
Joined: 15 May 2004
Posts: 34968
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| Posted: Fri Jul 07, 2006 5:19 pm Post subject: |
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Quote: then about 80% of the world is going to hell? that is insanity.
Only 8 people made it through the Flood.
The world is pretty much the same now as was then. When you consider that 100% of human beings don't deserve anything but this, 20% is a pretty high estimate. Could be .0005% for all we know.
Something to think about. |
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Hyde
Joined: 27 Feb 2006
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Location: somewhere in nowhere
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| Posted: Fri Jul 07, 2006 5:41 pm Post subject: |
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cap'n queasy wrote: Quote: then about 80% of the world is going to hell? that is insanity.
Only 8 people made it through the Flood.
The world is pretty much the same now as was then. When you consider that 100% of human beings don't deserve anything but this, 20% is a pretty high estimate. Could be .0005% for all we know.
Something to think about.
do you really think only 8 people surived? |
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toddytodd
Joined: 20 May 2006
Posts: 2736
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| Posted: Fri Jul 07, 2006 7:56 pm Post subject: |
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Hyde wrote: cap'n queasy wrote: Quote: then about 80% of the world is going to hell? that is insanity.
Only 8 people made it through the Flood.
The world is pretty much the same now as was then. When you consider that 100% of human beings don't deserve anything but this, 20% is a pretty high estimate. Could be .0005% for all we know.
Something to think about.
do you really think only 8 people surived?
Wouldn't that make for an even shallower gene pool? Eight people? |
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cap'n queasy
Joined: 15 May 2004
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| Posted: Sat Jul 08, 2006 1:26 am Post subject: |
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| What do genes mean in the afterlife? |
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toddytodd
Joined: 20 May 2006
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| Posted: Sat Jul 08, 2006 7:54 am Post subject: |
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cap'n queasy wrote: What do genes mean in the afterlife?
I would assume you are being funny and not really missing the point? |
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Hyde
Joined: 27 Feb 2006
Posts: 1062
Location: somewhere in nowhere
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| Posted: Sat Jul 08, 2006 1:46 pm Post subject: |
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toddytodd wrote: Hyde wrote: cap'n queasy wrote: Quote: then about 80% of the world is going to hell? that is insanity.
Only 8 people made it through the Flood.
The world is pretty much the same now as was then. When you consider that 100% of human beings don't deserve anything but this, 20% is a pretty high estimate. Could be .0005% for all we know.
Something to think about.
do you really think only 8 people surived?
Wouldn't that make for an even shallower gene pool? Eight people?
plus incest. wich is a sin. |
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cap'n queasy
Joined: 15 May 2004
Posts: 34968
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| Posted: Sat Jul 08, 2006 2:02 pm Post subject: |
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toddytodd wrote: cap'n queasy wrote: What do genes mean in the afterlife?
I would assume you are being funny and not really missing the point?
We are talking about going to hell, no?
I don't see that it is me who is missing the point. |
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wormwood
Joined: 24 Sep 2005
Posts: 2780
Location: The P-Brane
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| Posted: Sat Jul 08, 2006 2:39 pm Post subject: |
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I am not trying to be an ass but, I think it's really funny that you guys will believe that there is a God...and that this God flooded the entire world...disbelief still suspended... two of every animal and all that rot...then the problem with the story is that the genetics don't make sense :lol: . I am guessing a being who can command the weather and all the animals of the entire planet could probably fix a genetic inconsistency...just my opinion.
(also, didn't the three sons of Noah move to three different areas and become three different "races" of people? I might be mistaken, but I think that was the case) |
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LetsGetReal
Joined: 26 Aug 2004
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Location: Peoria, AZ
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| Posted: Sat Jul 08, 2006 4:42 pm Post subject: |
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wormwood wrote: I am not trying to be an ass but, I think it's really funny that you guys will believe that there is a God...and that this God flooded the entire world...disbelief still suspended... two of every animal and all that rot...then the problem with the story is that the genetics don't make sense :lol: . I am guessing a being who can command the weather and all the animals of the entire planet could probably fix a genetic inconsistency...just my opinion.
(also, didn't the three sons of Noah move to three different areas and become three different "races" of people? I might be mistaken, but I think that was the case) Shhh... don't tell them that, geez that might really believe he is all powerful. :lol: |
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toddytodd
Joined: 20 May 2006
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| Posted: Sun Jul 09, 2006 8:40 pm Post subject: |
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wormwood wrote: I am not trying to be an ass but, I think it's really funny that you guys will believe that there is a God...and that this God flooded the entire world...disbelief still suspended... two of every animal and all that rot...then the problem with the story is that the genetics don't make sense :lol: . I am guessing a being who can command the weather and all the animals of the entire planet could probably fix a genetic inconsistency...just my opinion.
(also, didn't the three sons of Noah move to three different areas and become three different "races" of people? I might be mistaken, but I think that was the case)
It is common religious response that, when something doesn't make any sense at all what-so-ever, to say 'God is all powerful and He did it" - case closed! It is an easy out.
But, with respect, that is their belief and they are entitled to it.
It has worked this way (and will continue to work this way), for those who choose to believe. And as long as it only harms the believers, then it is fine with me! For the rest of us, well....it's our choice to believe it to be a 'miracle' or a story told to prove a point. |
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Lumina
Joined: 16 Mar 2006
Posts: 19337
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| Posted: Sun Jul 09, 2006 10:47 pm Post subject: |
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wormwood wrote: I am not trying to be an ass but, I think it's really funny that you guys will believe that there is a God...and that this God flooded the entire world...disbelief still suspended... two of every animal and all that rot...then the problem with the story is that the genetics don't make sense :lol: . I am guessing a being who can command the weather and all the animals of the entire planet could probably fix a genetic inconsistency...just my opinion.
(also, didn't the three sons of Noah move to three different areas and become three different "races" of people? I might be mistaken, but I think that was the case)
Is worldwide flooding more difficult to believe than resurrection from the dead? |
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Hyde
Joined: 27 Feb 2006
Posts: 1062
Location: somewhere in nowhere
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| Posted: Sun Jul 09, 2006 11:53 pm Post subject: |
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Lumina wrote: wormwood wrote: I am not trying to be an ass but, I think it's really funny that you guys will believe that there is a God...and that this God flooded the entire world...disbelief still suspended... two of every animal and all that rot...then the problem with the story is that the genetics don't make sense :lol: . I am guessing a being who can command the weather and all the animals of the entire planet could probably fix a genetic inconsistency...just my opinion.
(also, didn't the three sons of Noah move to three different areas and become three different "races" of people? I might be mistaken, but I think that was the case)
Is worldwide flooding more difficult to believe than resurrection from the ?
not only flooding but 8 people repopulated the earth even with potential retarded babies. so ye, it is. |
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connermt
Joined: 27 Feb 2006
Posts: 1526
Location: CMH OHIO
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| Posted: Sat Jul 15, 2006 7:34 pm Post subject: |
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perdidochas wrote: Hyde wrote: Only1shot wrote: Jesus said you have to be reborn in spirit to enter the kingdom of heaven. To me this means that you do indeed have to be baptised to go to heaven.
then about 80% of the world is going to hell? that is insanity. what about the people that have never been introduced to christianity? they automaticaly go to hell because of where they where born and never got baptized? how ignorant can you get to say that only your religion can be right and everyone else is going to hell.
Well, the Catholic view is that, if possible, you should be baptized. If not baptized, you still have a chance at salvation, it's just not as high.
Wow - that's kinda harsh - why so? |
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