Political Crossfire Forums

ToonArmyIsComing · Joined: 15 Feb 2005 Posts: 5888 Location: Ontario

Disgusting ... father kills his son because he might become gay in the future! For the love of god, a 3 year old boy is neither heterosexual nor homosexual ... it's just disgusting that the man killed his son because he might turn out to be gay in his adult life. :x

Quote: Florida man convicted of murdering 3-year-old "gay" son

A Florida man stands convicted of second-degree murder after killing his 3-year-old son because he thought the boy might grow up to be gay. A Tampa jury on Thursday found Ronnie Paris Jr. guilty of second-degree manslaughter and aggravated child abuse in the death of his son, Ronnie Antonio Paris. According to The Tampa Tribune, the boy was beaten so badly that he became lethargic, stopped eating, and began wetting himself. On January 22 the boy went into a coma and died six days later. Experts testified that his death was caused by blunt trauma to the head.

The child's mother, Nysherra Paris, testified that her husband was trying to "toughen up" their son because he was worried he might grow up to be gay. Nysherra Paris, who never reported any abuse until February, is charged with child neglect and faces up to 15 years in prison if convicted. Ronnie Paris will be sentenced next month, and he faces life in prison.

http://www.advocate.com/news_detail.asp?id=18908

Locke25 · Joined: 12 Mar 2005 Posts: 3636 Location: Georgia

wow..... that's really f****d up

:cry:

Jay2014 · Joined: 31 May 2005 Posts: 1243

this is what extemism breeds.

thats sick

Melchior · Joined: 02 Oct 2004 Posts: 9482 Location: Palm Beach

That's pathetic...

StrangerWitCandy · Joined: 02 Feb 2005 Posts: 5453 Location: Fairfax, VA

what a moron. god thats sad

zuke · Joined: 23 Jun 2005 Posts: 87 Location: Buffalo, NY

Thats messed up.

Protostar · Posted: Tue Jul 19, 2005 11:46 am Post subject:

I agree, that is f****d up. The kid is three years old. Pop in GTA:SA, that'll toughen him up.

rainidame · Joined: 22 Apr 2005 Posts: 685 Location: in the dark

I've seen fathers do this sort of thing to children more often than not, just not so directly connected with being gay. . .

Y'know the fathers like mine who would back hand you with a fist then hit you again because you are crying, and again because you won't quit crying until we were literally unconscious on the floor. I'm a girl, just imagine how hard it was for my brother who was supposed to be tougher. I think men just get out of hand with their tempers then have to blame the victim, which becomes a destructive cycle.

It is still bad and wrong, don't misunderstand me, but I think the focus should be on all men who think little kids need toughening or should never cry or complain, these types are just the same as this man only they haven't killed their victims yet.

I envy the dead 3 year old. Would that I could have gotten out that early.

Protostar · Posted: Tue Jul 19, 2005 1:08 pm Post subject:

rainidame wrote: I've seen fathers do this sort of thing to children more often than not, just not so directly connected with being gay. . .

Y'know the fathers like mine who would back hand you with a fist then hit you again because you are crying, and again because you won't quit crying until we were literally unconscious on the floor. I'm a girl, just imagine how hard it was for my brother who was supposed to be tougher. I think men just get out of hand with their tempers then have to blame the victim, which becomes a destructive cycle.

It is still bad and wrong, don't misunderstand me, but I think the focus should be on all men who think little kids need toughening or should never cry or complain, these types are just the same as this man only they haven't killed their victims yet.

I envy the dead 3 year old. Would that I could have gotten out that early.

I understand what you're talking about but many fathers view "tough love" for their sons (and daughters) as a way to get them prepared for the real world. My father is included in this bunch. I think this is a good thing because it counteracts the mother's instinctive need to comfort the child no matter what. It's always not going to be okay and the world doesn't give a s**t if you cry and bawl. I think it's unreasonable to expect a child not to ever cry or complain (afterall they are children) but to baby them all the time is equally unreasonable. What this man did was wrong, any way you slice it. How can you determine if a child is a homosexual at only 3 years old? Hell, someone in another thread said that children that young don't even know if they're a boy or girl much less if they like other boys or girls. Most likely what happened is that the boy was probably acting to feminine for the likes of the father, and that could've been solved simply by spending more time with the child instead of passing him off to his mother.

ToonArmyIsComing · Joined: 15 Feb 2005 Posts: 5888 Location: Ontario

Protostar wrote: rainidame wrote: I've seen fathers do this sort of thing to children more often than not, just not so directly connected with being gay. . .

Y'know the fathers like mine who would back hand you with a fist then hit you again because you are crying, and again because you won't quit crying until we were literally unconscious on the floor. I'm a girl, just imagine how hard it was for my brother who was supposed to be tougher. I think men just get out of hand with their tempers then have to blame the victim, which becomes a destructive cycle.

It is still bad and wrong, don't misunderstand me, but I think the focus should be on all men who think little kids need toughening or should never cry or complain, these types are just the same as this man only they haven't killed their victims yet.

I envy the dead 3 year old. Would that I could have gotten out that early.

I understand what you're talking about but many fathers view "tough love" for their sons (and daughters) as a way to get them prepared for the real world. My father is included in this bunch. I think this is a good thing because it counteracts the mother's instinctive need to comfort the child no matter what. It's always not going to be okay and the world doesn't give a s**t if you cry and bawl. I think it's unreasonable to expect a child not to ever cry or complain (afterall they are children) but to baby them all the time is equally unreasonable. What this man did was wrong, any way you slice it. How can you determine if a child is a homosexual at only 3 years old? Hell, someone in another thread said that children that young don't even know if they're a boy or girl much less if they like other boys or girls. Most likely what happened is that the boy was probably acting to feminine for the likes of the father, and that could've been solved simply by spending more time with the child instead of passing him off to his mother.

I don't see any need for physical violence to make kids "toughen up"!!! Sustained violence at home usually has perverse effects on Children's development.

Protostar · Posted: Tue Jul 19, 2005 1:47 pm Post subject:

ToonArmyIsComing wrote: Protostar wrote: rainidame wrote: I've seen fathers do this sort of thing to children more often than not, just not so directly connected with being gay. . .

Y'know the fathers like mine who would back hand you with a fist then hit you again because you are crying, and again because you won't quit crying until we were literally unconscious on the floor. I'm a girl, just imagine how hard it was for my brother who was supposed to be tougher. I think men just get out of hand with their tempers then have to blame the victim, which becomes a destructive cycle.

It is still bad and wrong, don't misunderstand me, but I think the focus should be on all men who think little kids need toughening or should never cry or complain, these types are just the same as this man only they haven't killed their victims yet.

I envy the dead 3 year old. Would that I could have gotten out that early.

I understand what you're talking about but many fathers view "tough love" for their sons (and daughters) as a way to get them prepared for the real world. My father is included in this bunch. I think this is a good thing because it counteracts the mother's instinctive need to comfort the child no matter what. It's always not going to be okay and the world doesn't give a s**t if you cry and bawl. I think it's unreasonable to expect a child not to ever cry or complain (afterall they are children) but to baby them all the time is equally unreasonable. What this man did was wrong, any way you slice it. How can you determine if a child is a homosexual at only 3 years old? Hell, someone in another thread said that children that young don't even know if they're a boy or girl much less if they like other boys or girls. Most likely what happened is that the boy was probably acting to feminine for the likes of the father, and that could've been solved simply by spending more time with the child instead of passing him off to his mother.

I don't see any need for physical violence to make kids "toughen up"!!! Sustained violence at home usually has perverse effects on Children's development.

I'm not advocating violence against children (although I have no problem with physical discipline) I don't not see the problem with teelling the kid to "shut the hell up" when s/he doesn't get his/her way or is crying because of a little scratch. Kids today are far too soft and any attempt to "harden" them up is seen as abuse.

rainidame · Joined: 22 Apr 2005 Posts: 685 Location: in the dark

Protostar wrote: rainidame wrote: I've seen fathers do this sort of thing to children more often than not, just not so directly connected with being gay. . .

Y'know the fathers like mine who would back hand you with a fist then hit you again because you are crying, and again because you won't quit crying until we were literally unconscious on the floor. I'm a girl, just imagine how hard it was for my brother who was supposed to be tougher. I think men just get out of hand with their tempers then have to blame the victim, which becomes a destructive cycle.

It is still bad and wrong, don't misunderstand me, but I think the focus should be on all men who think little kids need toughening or should never cry or complain, these types are just the same as this man only they haven't killed their victims yet.

I envy the dead 3 year old. Would that I could have gotten out that early.

I understand what you're talking about but many fathers view "tough love" for their sons (and daughters) as a way to get them prepared for the real world. My father is included in this bunch. I think this is a good thing because it counteracts the mother's instinctive need to comfort the child no matter what. It's always not going to be okay and the world doesn't give a s**t if you cry and bawl. I think it's unreasonable to expect a child not to ever cry or complain (afterall they are children) but to baby them all the time is equally unreasonable. What this man did was wrong, any way you slice it. How can you determine if a child is a homosexual at only 3 years old? Hell, someone in another thread said that children that young don't even know if they're a boy or girl much less if they like other boys or girls. Most likely what happened is that the boy was probably acting to feminine for the likes of the father, and that could've been solved simply by spending more time with the child instead of passing him off to his mother.

My point is that the "gayness/toughness" aspect is just so much rationalization, that man was going to beat his son. . .if gayness wasn't in the news right now, something else would've been his excuse, . . . not xtian enough, or not smart enough, or whatever was a current "fear" that could be used for rationalization.

Again, I would think that at least the xtians on this site would consider this child better of dead to this world. I certainly do, if he had lived, say because the beating wasn't that bad, he would have had a life of near death experiences so long as his mother like mine covered her husbands arse. Better he is at peace in whatever form that takes.

rainidame · Joined: 22 Apr 2005 Posts: 685 Location: in the dark

If I could sentence the man, I would tie him to a post in the middle of town and invite adults who were abused children to come and stone or better yet icepick him to death, his wife too, she is at least as guilty. My mother actually set up our beatings by lying to him about what we did that day then sat at grinned the whole time.

ToonArmyIsComing · Joined: 15 Feb 2005 Posts: 5888 Location: Ontario

Protostar wrote: ToonArmyIsComing wrote: Protostar wrote: rainidame wrote: I've seen fathers do this sort of thing to children more often than not, just not so directly connected with being gay. . .

Y'know the fathers like mine who would back hand you with a fist then hit you again because you are crying, and again because you won't quit crying until we were literally unconscious on the floor. I'm a girl, just imagine how hard it was for my brother who was supposed to be tougher. I think men just get out of hand with their tempers then have to blame the victim, which becomes a destructive cycle.

It is still bad and wrong, don't misunderstand me, but I think the focus should be on all men who think little kids need toughening or should never cry or complain, these types are just the same as this man only they haven't killed their victims yet.

I envy the dead 3 year old. Would that I could have gotten out that early.

I understand what you're talking about but many fathers view "tough love" for their sons (and daughters) as a way to get them prepared for the real world. My father is included in this bunch. I think this is a good thing because it counteracts the mother's instinctive need to comfort the child no matter what. It's always not going to be okay and the world doesn't give a s**t if you cry and bawl. I think it's unreasonable to expect a child not to ever cry or complain (afterall they are children) but to baby them all the time is equally unreasonable. What this man did was wrong, any way you slice it. How can you determine if a child is a homosexual at only 3 years old? Hell, someone in another thread said that children that young don't even know if they're a boy or girl much less if they like other boys or girls. Most likely what happened is that the boy was probably acting to feminine for the likes of the father, and that could've been solved simply by spending more time with the child instead of passing him off to his mother.

I don't see any need for physical violence to make kids "toughen up"!!! Sustained violence at home usually has perverse effects on Children's development.

I'm not advocating violence against children (although I have no problem with physical discipline) I don't not see the problem with teelling the kid to "shut the hell up" when s/he doesn't get his/her way or is crying because of a little scratch. Kids today are far too soft and any attempt to "harden" them up is seen as abuse.

Well, telling children to "shut the hell up" in an angry manner doesn't seem like a good way to me. If I ever had a child, the most important thing for me would be to keep my cool when dealing with my child. I don't see the need for getting angry ...

Melchior · Joined: 02 Oct 2004 Posts: 9482 Location: Palm Beach

The way I see it, parents should never beat their kids, but I agree there is a point where bad kids need a good ass kicking (in which case they were already raised poorly). When it gets to that point, it's not the parent who gets to beat their kids, but those affected, like me. If your dumb kid ruins my property I should have the right to beat the crap out of him.

My two cents. :hip:

No, seriously, anger and violence in anger is a weakness. Physical discipline is pathetic and practiced by parents who don't know how to raise their kids.

Protostar · Posted: Tue Jul 19, 2005 2:11 pm Post subject:

rainidame wrote: Protostar wrote: rainidame wrote: I've seen fathers do this sort of thing to children more often than not, just not so directly connected with being gay. . .

Y'know the fathers like mine who would back hand you with a fist then hit you again because you are crying, and again because you won't quit crying until we were literally unconscious on the floor. I'm a girl, just imagine how hard it was for my brother who was supposed to be tougher. I think men just get out of hand with their tempers then have to blame the victim, which becomes a destructive cycle.

It is still bad and wrong, don't misunderstand me, but I think the focus should be on all men who think little kids need toughening or should never cry or complain, these types are just the same as this man only they haven't killed their victims yet.

I envy the dead 3 year old. Would that I could have gotten out that early.

I understand what you're talking about but many fathers view "tough love" for their sons (and daughters) as a way to get them prepared for the real world. My father is included in this bunch. I think this is a good thing because it counteracts the mother's instinctive need to comfort the child no matter what. It's always not going to be okay and the world doesn't give a s**t if you cry and bawl. I think it's unreasonable to expect a child not to ever cry or complain (afterall they are children) but to baby them all the time is equally unreasonable. What this man did was wrong, any way you slice it. How can you determine if a child is a homosexual at only 3 years old? Hell, someone in another thread said that children that young don't even know if they're a boy or girl much less if they like other boys or girls. Most likely what happened is that the boy was probably acting to feminine for the likes of the father, and that could've been solved simply by spending more time with the child instead of passing him off to his mother.

My point is that the "gayness/toughness" aspect is just so much rationalization, that man was going to beat his son. . .if gayness wasn't in the news right now, something else would've been his excuse, . . . not xtian enough, or not smart enough, or whatever was a current "fear" that could be used for rationalization.

Again, I would think that at least the xtians on this site would consider this child better of dead to this world. I certainly do, if he had lived, say because the beating wasn't that bad, he would have had a life of near death experiences so long as his mother like mine covered her husbands arse. Better he is at peace in whatever form that takes.

No, I don't I think the child could have been removed from the home and placed with someone else who would have cared for him. I think this turn of events is extremely unfortunate and the man (and his worthless wife) should be punished under the fullest extent of the law. BUt I guess you have a different view on things considering you were abused as a kid (I hope I don't come off as heartless, I'm really am sorry for what you went through).

ToonArmyIsComing wrote: Well, telling children to "shut the hell up" in an angry manner doesn't seem like a good way to me. If I ever had a child, the most important thing for me would be to keep my cool when dealing with my child. I don't see the need for getting angry ...

But if you're not firm with a child, they will continue to push you to the limit. It's nice to show a little anger with the child because they know you mean business. I agree, maybe telling the kid to "shut the hell up" isn't the best way of doing things but it gets the point across and that's what counts.

PrinceJunius · Posted: Tue Jul 19, 2005 2:12 pm Post subject:

I was never physically disciplined. I don't think I was the kind of kid who would learn much from a blow to the back of the head. My parents used guilt, and good God did that work like a charm.

ToonArmyIsComing · Joined: 15 Feb 2005 Posts: 5888 Location: Ontario

Protostar wrote: ToonArmyIsComing wrote: Well, telling children to "shut the hell up" in an angry manner doesn't seem like a good way to me. If I ever had a child, the most important thing for me would be to keep my cool when dealing with my child. I don't see the need for getting angry ...

But if you're not firm with a child, they will continue to push you to the limit. It's nice to show a little anger with the child because they know you mean business. I agree, maybe telling the kid to "shut the hell up" isn't the best way of doing things but it gets the point across and that's what counts.

Being firm and being violent and angry are two different things! You could tell the kid "NO" in a firm, but calm manner, or you could yell like a mad man and chase the kid around the house to show your firmness! I think the first choice is a lot better personally ... It gets the point across!

Protostar · Posted: Tue Jul 19, 2005 2:20 pm Post subject:

PrinceJunius wrote: I was never physically disciplined. I don't think I was the kind of kid who would learn much from a blow to the back of the head. My parents used guilt, and good God did that work like a charm.

I was the exact opposite. If my parents ever told me they were disappointed in me, I'd simply go to my room and read or play video games like it never happened (or mattered). But when they took off the belt (especially my dad, probably because he's stronger) whatever they beat me for, I never did again. I can personally say I'm all the better for it, and will do the same with my kids if I ever have any.

Heres a funny take on child discipline

http://www.maddox.xmission.com/beat.html

Maddox is so awesome.

zuke · Joined: 23 Jun 2005 Posts: 87 Location: Buffalo, NY

I was spanked in my day, I turned out alright. Or did I?

Gays not being tough is a load of crock. I have a few gay friends and some of them could kick my ass. (Not all of them)