Political Crossfire Forums

[SPOTTEDGREENDUCK]

A.D wrote: The gloves have come off now, and it’s all too obvious for those who pay attention.

Howard’s attack on universities, increasing fees, increasing full paying students, abolishing student unions, coupled with Howard’s war on workers, giving employers more power (as if the needed it). Add this with tax cuts for the rich, and crumbs for the poor and you have a potent cocktail.


Is Howard trying to create a two tier society in Australia?

Sounds like a drug smoking, arts degree underachiever having a whinge.
Stop reading all that left wing propaganda son, wake up and smell the roses.

[cassandrabandra]

Barnaby Joyce on the passing of the VSU in the senate, quoted in Rolling stone, according to my sources:

Quote: Q.What drove the Coalition's VSU push?

B.J.To be quite frank, I know it's not driven by the whole Coalition party. It's driven by a cabal of redneck philistines.

Q.Who are simply anti-union?

B.J.They're just anti-life. It's strange that people get uncomfortable about someone enjoying life. The vast majority of [senators] didn't know what they were voting for, and those who did were motivated by factors - you could hear it in their speeches - which had very little to do with any sort of cognisant argument. They were a terrible lot to do with bile on the liver about a previous political stoush they'd had at University, which is ridiculous and unhealthy. You've got to leave that stuff behind and move on. I don't believe in compulsion to do anything. But I do believe the university has the right to charge for its infrastructure.

[raf]

Lord Hargreaves wrote: Good job John Howard, stay firm in the face of socialism :tu:

Oh my god you British tw*t. You sound like some upper class knob. I mean, with a name like “Lord Hargreaves”? No bloody wonder; who gives a sh*t about "Lords" these days. The cold war is over mate; the extremist left don’t pose that much of a threat anymore. History is repeating itself, society is becoming conservative again. You and your conservative buddies have the power now, no need to rub it in.

A.D wrote: Btw Lord Hargreaves, Howard isn’t fighting socialism, he’s fighting working families.
Hear hear! I totally agree.

SPOTTEDGREENDUCK wrote: Sounds like a drug smoking, arts degree underachiever having a whinge.
Stop reading all that left wing propaganda son, wake up and smell the roses.
Sounds like a militarist, uneducated ignoramus believing John Howard’s lies and protecting the flawed status quo
Stop reading The Daily Telegraph and all that Murdoch endorsed ring-wing, conservative b/s progaganda of fear, open your narrow mind and wake up and see that the roses you think you're smelling, is actually Howard's sh*t.

[social]

SPOTTEDGREENDUCK wrote: A.D wrote: The gloves have come off now, and it’s all too obvious for those who pay attention.

Howard’s attack on universities, increasing fees, increasing full paying students, abolishing student unions, coupled with Howard’s war on workers, giving employers more power (as if the needed it). Add this with tax cuts for the rich, and crumbs for the poor and you have a potent cocktail.


Is Howard trying to create a two tier society in Australia?

Sounds like a drug smoking, arts degree underachiever having a whinge.
Stop reading all that left wing propaganda son, wake up and smell the roses.

I find it humorously ironic that you're branding A.D. a 'drug smoking, underachiever' given your username, 'SpottedGreenDuck.' With a name like that, I'd be much more willing to assume you're the one in need of a cup of coffee, and a rather abrupt wake-up call. :lol:

[Ch33kY]

I'm not against VSU because students should not be forced to pay fees for something they are not part of. However, this means they should be excluded from all Student Union (SU) activities and thus not allowed to enter any SU facilities nor recieve any benefits of SU.

What is more concerning is the Industrial Relations Act which will be passed during the Commonwealth Games...oh, wait, you can't protest it because using the Commonwealth Games for political purposes, that means staging a protest under the guidelines of the International Decleration of Human Rights, is a criminal offence.

I don't get why people aren't protesting like the French are. Australians have developed a very passive acceptance to the whole thing considering their very futures are on the line.

[cassandrabandra]

Ch33kY wrote: I'm not against VSU because students should not be forced to pay fees for something they are not part of. However, this means they should be excluded from all Student Union (SU) activities and thus not allowed to enter any SU facilities nor recieve any benefits of SU.

What is more concerning is the Industrial Relations Act which will be passed during the Commonwealth Games...oh, wait, you can't protest it because using the Commonwealth Games for political purposes, that means staging a protest under the guidelines of the International Decleration of Human Rights, is a criminal offence.

I don't get why people aren't protesting like the French are. Australians have developed a very passive acceptance to the whole thing considering their very futures are on the line.

Those who usually have the srongest voice are doing reasonably well at the moment ... so they've got a bit of a 'she'll be right' attitude at present. If we start sliding into a recession they'll wonder what hit ... but it will be too late.

at the moment things are pretty OK here in the land of Oz unless you are on benefits, or from a less well to do family and thinking about tertiary study.

actually, the drop off in student enrolments at several universities is a bit of a worry ... because people can get jobs, and paying through the nose for a tertiary education where there's no guarantee you are going to earn any more ... but will have to pay higher taxes ... doesn't seem to make a lot of sense.

VSU - well yes - but if you take a look at what student unions actually provide for students (and de facto to the universities as well) you have to wonder what will happen. All those students who end up completing their courses because they've been helped by student unions are actually quite a significant number - and many prefer to approach the student union because it is independent and not part of the Uni rather than embedded services. There are so many things ... but it will go the same as unionism.

Do you know that in the late 70's roughly 43% of the Oz workforce was unionised? now its maybe in the low twenties ...those sectors that are highly unionised have much better wages and conditions than those who don't.

In some areas, such as metal trades they are bringing in 'guest workers' to fill labour shortage needs - which exist because of privatization and outsourcing (large government departments, transport authorities, public hospitals etc don't take on their annual intake of thousands of apprentices as they did even in the early eighties) - paying them sometimes 1/3 of what they'd pay a local tradesman, and keep him in the dark about the role of unions etc. you see differential wages in some places based on residency. technically that goes against the principle of equal pay for equal work, but it is allowed. This is only happening because metal trades union membership (always one of the strongest) is also falling.

anyway - in the long run - with a skeleton IR system that had too little input from workers, once this country goes into recession (which it will do eventually) the s**t will hit the fan ... and only THEN will people start realizing why we had unions in the first place.

Mark Twain (creator orf Tom Sawyer/Huck Finn, and a social commentator on a range of issues) visited Australia early last century and described Australia as a working man's paradise. Don't think he'd be saying that now.