Political Crossfire Forums

[timmtc]

cap'n queasy wrote: If I was Canadian I would be worried about losing my national sovereignty.
Why do you guys seem to hold the UN in such high regard?

I am worried about that queasy, which is why the Canadian Conservatives wanted to increase or military so we can stand by our own opinions, and not be dragged along by the UN. The UN is a joke, and I hope that Canadians one day will realize this.

[Canada_Rocks]

timtc.. I agree with you a bit. We do need to increase our millitary spending but only for the means of possible UN participation.
Canada does not need an independant army.

[Crazy_Canuck]

The most difficult logistical part of having an army is training thee troops. Making stuff is easy, Russia modernized IN THE FACE OF A GERMAN ASSULT.
I'm pretty sure we could do so since we are not currently under siege.

Also, we put the UN in high regard as a medium to solve problems WITHOUT WARS. That is why it was created. If any one nation moves against any other nation all other nations would b**** slap the agressor nations. Granted this only applies to the elite industrialized nations, but hey, Canada IS an elite industtrialized nation.

Not to mention that financially speaking we can afford a build up more than the States right now. Seen the debt numbers lately. OMFG.

[Amaterasu]

ChaseNorth wrote:

Amen!

I'm just curious to know what Canadians feel about how/when their nation should serve in the world. My own opinion is that I feel Canada should modernize it's army, not upsize. New equipment and weapons.

Canada's army is a defensive one. It also plays a peacekeeping role in cooperation with the UN. I am fine with that, but Canadian soldiers must be equiped to handle those jobs properly.

[Amaterasu]

ChaseNorth wrote:
Here is what one poster wrote:

***************

the premise of your article is flawed in that you assume that the prevailing attitude is that Canadians see themselves as a cohesive unit. They don't.
Maybe he doesn't. Canadians are like any family. The siblings fight, but if anyone tries to beat on one of them, they have to deal with the rest of Canada.

Quote: Part of it is political. It has been political with various levels of government pitting the different provinces against each other for political gain.

The province I live in is always 'at war with the East' with enough rhetoric on both sides to sink a battleship.
See above.

Quote: Part of it is with the official government policy of multiculturalism where each new group new immigrant group is allowed to keep its own identity and is encouraged to do so.

You can ask a large number of Canadians what nationality they are and they will tell you that they are 'whatever nationality'-Canadian.

If you ask an American with their melting pot doctrine they will tell you they are American. No hyphen.

This leads to a society that has no distinct idea of nationality and one that defines itself by what it is not.
Every immigrant group seems to blend in nicely with the other. One possible exception being Quebec French. But in times of war, French or English or Martian-Canadian, they all fight side by side.

Quote: This is why you get so many slams at Americans. It sets us apart from them even though we are not really sure why.
This guy has never met an Italian-American, has he? Whether Canada or America, immigrant groups "blend in" after a couple generations, and they may or may not keep some of their traditional customs or language, Mexican, Italian, Chinese, Indian, it doesn't matter.

Quote: You also have to remember that many of the Canadian provinces were settled at different times by different populations and have created identities that are much stronger than those between American states.

There are even vast differences ideological differences between Alberta and Saskatchewan because of this.

Saskatchewan was settled earlier by peoples from the British Empire and as a result is much more socialist.

Alberta on the other hand, and this is a dirty little Canadian secret, was settled by a large number of Americans and is much more free enterprise as a result.
Funny, I grew up in Alberta and the vast majority of communities were Eastern European. Ukrainian, German, Russian, and Polish especially. In fact, I remember learning this in school, so I checked. This is what I found.

"It was not until the Canadian Pacific Railway reached the area in 1883 that settlement of any consequence began. By the 1890s a tide of immigration into the West was underway, peaking just prior to the outbreak of the First World War. Between 1901 and 1905, 40,000 homesteads were granted in what in 1905 became the province of Alberta. Homesteaders were given freehold title to their land in exchange for paying $10, agreeing to stay on the land at least three years, breaking a certain amount of land each year and building a house. The settlers came mainly from Europe (especially northern, central and eastern Europe and the British Isles)."

I do not doubt that settlers came from America and other parts of Canada. I just think that his implications are misleading.

Quote: Before people start screaming about this ask yourself why American immigrants were classified according to the nationality of their last names and not the nationality of the nation they were born in.
I have NO clue what he was leading to in this sentence.

Quote: Also remember that in vast areas of Southern Alberta are predominantly Mormon and they are not recent converts. Their ancestors who moved here were Mormon.

The Mounties were also created not to protect the Native American population. They were created to make sure that American settlers in the West, Saskatchewan, B.C. and Alberta, did not create another Texas.
I am beginning to suspect that this man suffers from paranoia. The RCMP, or the early NWMP were created to police the western territories. They served as police and magistrates, and enforced the laws as well as borders. The only possible invasion force would have been fron America, but the worst American entanglement the NWMP faced was the American whiskey traders who invaded in droves. :wink:
They enforced the laws of Canada, so if making American immigrants follow Canadian laws is tatamount to "ensuring it didn't become like Texas", well, I guess this poster is correct, although again misleading.

Quote: You keep referring to Canada's great war record but have to remember we only entered the Boer War, World War 1 and World War 2 because we saw ourselves as part of the British Empire and we had to do our part for them.
That is one man's opinion. I would ask the opinions of the men who volunteered in WWII. Canada, unlike it's allies, did not have to rely on conscription. Canadian men volunteered by the thousands. I suspect that they were only trying to escape the damn cold Canadian winters though.

Quote: We got involved in Korea because the UN was new and the old WW2 alliances were still fresh.

We got into peacekeeping because it helped set us apart from the Americans who were involved in another war at the time.
Again, this would be one man's opinion.

Quote: To be fair there were various attempts to try to establish ourselves as an independent middling power but those pushing it often became lazy when trying to implement it and just gave it lip service.

The fact that it allowed the governments of the time to divest themselves of expensive things like aircraft carriers and tanks and spend that money on social programs didn't hurt.
I think I finally found something he has said that made any sense.

Quote: You ask what makes a Canadian a Canadian but the problem is that most Canadians don't know what the answer is.
A love of Canada and the things she stands for. Humanity, freedom, and a future for our children. That and good beer while watching a hockey game and complaining about the weather.

Poor confused boy. I feel sorry for him. He seems bitter and doesn't have his own identity. Once he gets through puberty, he will begin to develop his own sense of independance and identity. We all go through it.



Quote: Any comments, ideas, thoughts on it?

Was his response accurate? Just My Humble Opinion. :)